Speaker 1: 00:00

We can talk about real stuff anytime you want.

Speaker 2: 00:01

This is real stuff.

Speaker 3: 00:02

This is real. Okay.

Speaker 1: 00:04

This this is the Typecraft's fears hour.

Speaker 2: 00:31

Adam's not very well traveled. He's never left Missouri. Never left Missouri? That's not true.

Speaker 1: 00:37

Who who was in the city then? Who did I see?

Speaker 2: 00:39

He's never seen the ocean.

Speaker 3: 00:41

I've actually been to Connecticut.

Speaker 2: 00:44

Oh, really?

Speaker 3: 00:45

Well, I've drove through New Haven, New London, just on the coast. We drove from Boston to New York once, so

Speaker 1: 00:51

Oh, nice. Yeah. That's nice.

Speaker 2: 00:52

I can't even picture you on the East Coast. That's so weird. You've literally

Speaker 3: 00:56

hung out with me multiple times on the East Coast.

Speaker 2: 00:58

No. I know. But like driving from Boston to whatever, that's like a very New England situation.

Speaker 3: 01:06

Yeah. Didn't I didn't drive. My parents drove. So when I was in high school, my senior year of high school, me and my brother had this favorite band called Dispatch.

Speaker 1: 01:15

Nice.

Speaker 3: 01:15

They were like really really big in the Napster era.

Speaker 1: 01:18

Mhmm. Yeah.

Speaker 3: 01:19

I'm just digging it. Okay. So we went to the last Dispatch, which was in Boston. My parents drove us from the Ozarks to Boston.

Speaker 1: 01:28

Wow. We drove. Was a Yeah.

Speaker 2: 01:30

Is that cheaper than flying?

Speaker 3: 01:31

I don't know. My parents just don't fly, but we never flew growing up.

Speaker 2: 01:35

And your brother's a pilot now. Yeah. Damn. Turns out.

Speaker 1: 01:39

That's awesome. That's rebellion right there.

Speaker 3: 01:41

Exactly. I

Speaker 1: 01:43

don't mind driving. My problem, and this is gonna sound really crazy, is I cannot drive over large bridges.

Speaker 3: 01:49

Oh, interesting. Interesting.

Speaker 1: 01:51

I have a sincere fear of heights on bridges, specifically when driving. If I'm the passenger, it's lovely. I look out, it's just a nice like experience, but driving something about it. That call like to the void of like, you're gonna steer this way and go straight off the bridge. I don't know what that is.

Speaker 1: 02:09

I can't can't do it.

Speaker 2: 02:10

I totally relate at some point. Probably right when I was like becoming an adult, I had the same thing just with heights in general where I was just I didn't have to go near something high. My brain would just be like, hey, how far can you lean over without falling over? And that just freaked me out. Yeah.

Speaker 2: 02:26

And it's at the point now where like, most heights are okay, but then one of my friends there's a lot of buildings in Miami that are crazy tall and everyone has a balcony. And when I like go out there, I feel like the ground is not stable. Like it's it's like really impacting me where I feel like any moment I'm just gonna like lose my balance and go over the edge. So I can I can relate to that?

Speaker 1: 02:48

It's funny. It's like it's not just a mental like issue, it's also like physical,

Speaker 2: 02:52

Physical, you know, like

Speaker 1: 02:53

yeah. You physically cannot do the thing or you feel like you're going to fall over or pass out or whatever. Like, I went to a wedding in Ireland, which was, I mean, beautiful country. I did not know how mountainous the West Of Ireland is. It's very like mountainous and their wedding was on top of what you would probably consider, like, just a large, like, hill.

Speaker 1: 03:14

Like, not really even a mountain so much, but, like, the way everything was set up and driving up it, I couldn't go to the actual ceremony because I got too too much anxiety. I had to, like, stop and, like, sort of hang out in the parking lot and then meet everyone else at the hotel at the bottom of the of the mountain.

Speaker 3: 03:29

So it's like it's like extreme.

Speaker 2: 03:32

Gets bad. Yeah. I it's Yeah.

Speaker 1: 03:33

Like I said, it's like a physical thing. Like I physically think I'm gonna pass out and like I don't know what it is. Like, it's just it's just crazy fears. Like, I can't stop my mind from saying, like, you're driving this car, like, out of this crazy incline. And at some point, you're gonna, I don't know, hit a rock and the whole car just falls right off the mountain.

Speaker 1: 03:52

Right? Like that's Mhmm. That's what happens in my mind. I don't know how to I don't know how to turn that off.

Speaker 2: 03:55

It's hard. No. It is a weirdly physical thing.

Speaker 1: 03:57

It happened as an adult. I did not have this fear until I was like 25. Yeah. Oh, really? Yeah.

Speaker 2: 04:03

That's when your frontal lobe develops and you're no longer invincible.

Speaker 1: 04:07

It's true. Yeah. Maybe that's it. That that could be it. Yeah.

Speaker 3: 04:10

I'm afraid of heights. Just like normal afraid of heights. And I try I I can't remember the last time I was in a situation where I had to be afraid because I just avoid tall things, I guess. Mhmm. I don't leave

Speaker 1: 04:20

the Ozarks. Yes.

Speaker 3: 04:20

That's the key.

Speaker 2: 04:21

You are a tall thing.

Speaker 1: 04:23

Mhmm. Okay.

Speaker 2: 04:25

Both of you, I think.

Speaker 1: 04:27

Yeah. Adam, surprisingly tall.

Speaker 3: 04:29

You too surprisingly. Surprisingly.

Speaker 1: 04:31

I don't know. I feel like anytime I meet someone around my height, it's surprising. So Yeah. Yeah.

Speaker 3: 04:37

I love your backdrop. I love all of your content. I love the things you make. I don't say that to people.

Speaker 1: 04:41

Oh, thank you. Oh, sure. Yeah.

Speaker 3: 04:43

I don't like the word content.

Speaker 2: 04:44

It just yeah. Your stuff just started popping up on my stuff like just the internet throws stuff at me and then you it just started throwing your stuff at me more

Speaker 3: 04:52

recently. Nice.

Speaker 2: 04:53

Nice. And I watch a bunch of your like terminal related stuff like some of the Neovim stuff, some of the I think T Muck stuff, I can't remember exactly. But yeah, great background.

Speaker 3: 05:04

Agree. Good vibes.

Speaker 1: 05:05

I stole it from Aaron Francis.

Speaker 2: 05:08

The pegboard thing. The pegboard. Yeah.

Speaker 1: 05:11

I didn't steal from him. I so the thing I've been telling myself to make me feel better is that I I did have pegboard, I think, before he did his office thing, but my I had, a different angle, like, from here. I didn't have as much stuff. And then when I saw his setup, I was like, oh my god, I'm so close to that. I just gotta make

Speaker 2: 05:26

the camera go over here

Speaker 1: 05:28

then I'm good. And so that was that was kind of the evolution of it. But, yeah, thank you. I'm I'm happy with it.

Speaker 2: 05:34

Have you guys seen that Dream Studio company?

Speaker 3: 05:36

No. Yeah. Kevin

Speaker 2: 05:38

Yeah. I I think maybe so, Kent C. Dodgers posted about it but Mhmm. So they originally made a course on like how to make a nice studio and like they cover every part of it, lighting, background, camera stuff. But now, you can just hire them and they come to your place and they like do it all for you.

Speaker 2: 05:55

They set it to design your thing with like this lens of

Speaker 1: 05:59

It's called Dream Studio? Mhmm.

Speaker 2: 06:01

And That's pretty cool. It's it's crazy to me that because we've been talking about this at SST how like just making stuff has gotten so much easier in a lot of ways that if you're someone with any amount of expertise, can just like can just also do this thing where you're like making content for people. Mhmm. To the point where there's now this entire company that just helps people set up studios and that's like a seems like a thriving business.

Speaker 1: 06:26

That's super cool. Yeah. No, this is all trial and error. Mhmm. And it's funny like even when you have a good setup, I'm and sure you guys have probably experienced this, it's like you have a good setup but like it just doesn't look right and then you have like a nice camera but you don't know how to make the settings look just right and like Mhmm.

Speaker 1: 06:43

You know, this microphone like didn't sound great at first. You have to get like a cloud lifter type thing because it's Oh

Speaker 2: 06:48

man, this microphone was the worst thing ever. It's like Yeah. It's so It it's actually horrible by default and then you have to like get a cloud lifter and then you have to process the shit out of it. And then it sounds pretty good but, wow. I did not expect that when I started.

Speaker 1: 07:03

Yeah. It's it is it's everything is shittier than you assume it is because like coming from the outside, you look at these people with like these really nice setup and you're like, wow, that looks awesome. And you're like, all I have to do is get this this and this and like I should like have the same thing. And then you get them and you're like, oh no, it's actually like many hours of trial and error and setting it up and like, what are the settings? It's crazy.

Speaker 1: 07:22

Like just buying like a lav mic. I have a lav mic for a couple of videos we did. Just those settings took me hours. Because like Mhmm. I set it up, I download some software, I'm like, I get it all set up and then their own sort of gain that they put on things.

Speaker 1: 07:51

So, you have to turn down the camera's gain so that the lav mic is coming through more pure and it's like, it's just insane. Like this all of this is so difficult. I love making videos. I hate the the setup of it.

Speaker 3: 08:03

Yeah. The the expectation is just risen and risen. Right? Like, I think YouTube, every every like video is high quality now. So if you don't have all these things, it just kinda like stands out in a bad way.

Speaker 3: 08:16

It used to be like, I remember when the Zoom era, like COVID and the pandemic, everybody got a camera and it was like, oh, you should have a better Zoom appearance. Mhmm. But now it's just gone to like crazy degrees. Yeah. You've got set design behind you.

Speaker 3: 08:29

I mean, it's just like, where does it end?

Speaker 2: 08:31

Yeah. Yeah. I I I miss the days where all the content on YouTube was like from like an angle down here.

Speaker 1: 08:37

Yeah. Like MacBook webcam.

Speaker 2: 08:39

Just like looking up up

Speaker 3: 08:40

your nose. Wish I could be one of those people. I wish I could be one of the people that just like, it's about the content. And I'm just gonna look terrible and it's gonna be like grainy and awful audio. But like, people are gonna love it because I'm awesome.

Speaker 3: 08:51

But I can't. I just go like, not awesome.

Speaker 2: 08:54

I have a good camera.

Speaker 1: 08:56

Pretty boring. Yeah. No. It's it's funny.

Speaker 2: 08:59

Yeah. That's

Speaker 1: 09:00

I think that's a lot I had to overcome too. It's like, have to make stuff look good because I don't think I'm I think I'm all that interesting other than that. You know? Because there are people like, you know you know, Prime obviously like so so so entertaining that like he doesn't you don't even have to see him and you're just entertained by what he's saying because he's so fun and funny.

Speaker 3: 09:18

And like Yeah.

Speaker 1: 09:18

I feel like I'm a very calm like muted kind of personality. So Mhmm. I have to have like this stuff to like actually stand out. You know what I mean?

Speaker 2: 09:26

Yeah. You gotta play to your strengths. I I did learn a new word recently that I'm sorry, Adam, but you're the first person I thought of when I heard this word.

Speaker 3: 09:34

Oh, man.

Speaker 2: 09:34

You might have seen this post. There's a post on Twitter that was like, we need a name for someone that is new to a hobby and buys all the best equipment right away. And so and so I replied being like, oh, this already exists. It's called a Buyhard. And I was

Speaker 1: 09:47

like Buyhard.

Speaker 3: 09:51

My god.

Speaker 2: 09:52

That's so creepy. I was like, that's literally Adam. Adam's a buyhard.

Speaker 1: 09:55

Oh, hell yeah. I love that.

Speaker 3: 09:58

This is fun. I get into stuff, you know. Anything I take on, it's like you just get into it and you wanna you wanna look the part, you wanna own all the stuff and then go from there. But it is like that feeling like Typecraft said. You buy a thing and you think like, this is easy.

Speaker 3: 10:11

I bought the thing. And it's like, oh, no. I have to actually learn how to use the thing.

Speaker 2: 10:15

Yeah. That part sucks.

Speaker 1: 10:16

Yeah. That's the hardest.

Speaker 2: 10:18

Yeah. It's like it doesn't just come out of the box looking good. It actually was than the easier choice. Yeah. Exactly.

Speaker 2: 10:24

I don't know if you guys can tell. So I messed with my camera, assuming at this stuff, my camera color setting, like my white balance setting like a long time ago, maybe like six months ago and it's never felt like fixing it. Throughout this call, I will go from being looking very orange to looking completely pale. It's just constantly shifting. Like right now, I'm like going towards the orange side and then it'll just randomly start to like make me pale again, so

Speaker 3: 10:46

Like do you have like other light coming in that's unpredictable or is it

Speaker 2: 10:50

I I don't know what it is at all because it's like I'm in a dark room with the window closed. So Mhmm. I have no idea.

Speaker 1: 10:58

I wouldn't worry about that. I'm going to go from kind of red to very red because I'm in a small home office and like, I can't I can't stop the heat coming out from here. So like,

Speaker 2: 11:08

it's just

Speaker 1: 11:08

gonna get warmer and warmer.

Speaker 3: 11:09

And the light

Speaker 1: 11:10

The camera might shut off, you know, we'll see. That does remind me.

Speaker 3: 11:14

For sure.

Speaker 1: 11:15

It does remind me.

Speaker 2: 11:15

Oh, look, Sam, I'm really orange now.

Speaker 1: 11:17

I have a fan for the camera. Let me just install it

Speaker 2: 11:19

real Oh.

Speaker 1: 11:21

Just just so we don't forget. Keep it cool. Yeah. Yep. Hold, please.

Speaker 1: 11:25

Hold, please.

Speaker 3: 11:26

Oh, these are real problems for the point one percent of camera. That is so crazy. I have an a seven four that overheats when I have to I have to do things.

Speaker 2: 11:36

I have not shut off my camera in like a year.

Speaker 1: 11:38

It's just all the time?

Speaker 3: 11:41

Yeah. Really?

Speaker 1: 11:42

See, this is the other thing too and it's funny like, this whole discussion we're having like just kinda falls right in the line with this too. It's like you get a nice camera. It's a DSLR. We have a the Sony a 6,700 is really nice. But you set it up and you're like, oh, let me do a stream.

Speaker 1: 11:58

Oh, wow. Look how good I look. Let's go on like Twitch for a little while. And then your camera just shuts off in a half an hour and you're like, oh my god. It just cannot handle like the heat it generates when it's like live, like, you know, just the the the signal's going right to the computer's capture card.

Speaker 1: 12:12

Mhmm. And the the camera's just not built for that. So, again

Speaker 3: 12:16

Yeah. There's just a million combinations of equipment and settings and

Speaker 2: 12:20

Yeah. I'm also on Linux, so I'm like playing Oh, these on hard Yeah. You on Linux now? I've been on Linux forever.

Speaker 1: 12:27

Oh, hell yeah. I didn't know that. About ten years.

Speaker 2: 12:29

I've actually Adam makes a joke because I everything I said I've been doing has been for ten years. Because I basically wasn't doing anything ten years before that. I was like a child before that, not really doing That's awesome.

Speaker 1: 12:40

I always assumed since you are a JavaScript guy that you're a Mac guy. I don't know why. It's just like, that's a strong correlation with me. Yeah. Yeah.

Speaker 1: 12:50

No,

Speaker 2: 12:51

it makes sense. It's funny because I'm actually for the first time using more Mac stuff. Like I got a MacBook as my laptop and I I I just haven't used a laptop in a long time and I finally like added that to my workflow. But I just SSH into my Linux server and do everything through there. Hell yeah.

Speaker 1: 13:08

It's just I love

Speaker 2: 13:09

the hardware which I think is great. Also in this set, I've talked about this a bunch, I'm gonna say it again. Because all my development is remote, the MacBook which already has crazy good battery life gets like insane battery life because it's literally doing nothing. Like I can use it for like two days without having to charge it. It's like it's really wild.

Speaker 2: 13:28

So I'm really happy about that. But yeah, everything I do is still Linux. And it's funny like I I am a JavaScript person, but I all I do is write Go because all of our tooling is written in Go.

Speaker 1: 13:37

Oh, nice.

Speaker 2: 13:38

So I don't actually write that much JavaScript.

Speaker 1: 13:40

Oh, very cool. I like I love the idea of having a MacBook where you just you develop elsewhere. I I I got obsessed with this whole concept of like a thin client for

Speaker 3: 13:51

Mhmm.

Speaker 1: 13:52

Years. Like years ago, I made like before I ever did any videos, I made a whole blog post on and stuff. And I I had this set up. Does anyone remember the the Google Pixel Slate, the tablet they came out Yeah.

Speaker 2: 14:05

I do remember that. Yeah.

Speaker 1: 14:06

So it was just powerful enough that you could have like it it still ran the full, oh my god, what Chrome OS, you know? And it had just enough on it where you could open a terminal and SSH to a client. I had a digital ocean droplet somewhere that would SSH into, and that was actually like my work computer for like a couple of years. I went a little bit crazy with it, but but no, I love I love the concept of like the thin clients. It's I think that's really cool.

Speaker 3: 14:32

So you you have a video because I was just perusing your YouTube before we got on here. I don't do research for the show, but I just I like you. And I was like, I wanna see Ty Crust Page.

Speaker 1: 14:41

I like you guys too.

Speaker 3: 14:42

Yeah. I saw a video. You did one on this idea of what Dax does of, like, remotely like, should I remotely SSH into my machine or whatever? Basically, this concept. I need both of you.

Speaker 3: 14:54

I didn't watch the video because I I didn't have time. And Dax, I've probably heard you say it, but I forgot. Could you sell me what why should I not just do this on my local machine? Like, I just run t mux on my Mac and that's like when I shut down my Mac, it's all gone and I started back up. Is that the main benefit?

Speaker 3: 15:08

I could just keep it up all

Speaker 2: 15:09

the That that's one. Yeah. Like I literally my sessions are always up when I switch from my desktop to my MacBook. It's just it's like it's literally on the same file, the cursor in the exact same position I was just in. My computer reboots, whatever.

Speaker 2: 15:22

Like it's I don't have to rebuild anything. I also have like to have TMUX saving all that anyway, so if I do need to bring it back up, it's it's it's, you know, comes back to the similar spot.

Speaker 1: 15:32

Mhmm.

Speaker 2: 15:32

But for me, my whole issue was just this, I've always built my own computers.

Speaker 1: 15:36

Me too.

Speaker 2: 15:37

With this like for again, forever my logic was, I'm gonna build this computer because I can upgrade the parts one by one. Sorry to buy a whole new computer. I can just get the CPU later. I've really never done that because by the time I want a new CPU You owe the socket. Yeah, the socket change.

Speaker 2: 15:53

If I'm gonna get a new motherboard, I might as well get the new RAM for it. So I effectively just never did that. And what's worse is I'm horrible at like selling stuff. So I'm like, I don't even I'm just not gonna officially even get rid of this. So I just got tired of the hardware upgrades and it's funny because unfortunately JavaScript tooling is extremely slow.

Speaker 2: 16:13

So and it's completely bottlenecked by single core performance and I work on some like really like heavy typed code bases where

Speaker 1: 16:20

Mhmm.

Speaker 2: 16:21

Their libraries, when you're using them, it's fine. But when you're working on a library itself, like things can get pretty slow. So for me, like having the fastest single core CPU like makes a difference. And when I if I can rent that, every year somebody else deals with the hardware upgrade. They like, you know, buy the new stuff, put it together, they know how to recycle the old stuff or like find a way to like, you know, lower the price and sell to someone else to get an efficient thing.

Speaker 2: 16:46

Yep. And I just pay like a fixed monthly price for that forever. And right now I'm using this like crazy server from Reliable Site. It's like the like the the highest Ryzen AMD CPU right now. Is it

Speaker 1: 16:58

called Reliable Site or A Reliable Site?

Speaker 2: 17:00

No, it's called Reliable Site. No. It's the Reliable Site. This because they give this to me for free so I can talk about them. So, I just say it very clearly, reliablesite.com.

Speaker 3: 17:12

Reliablesite name is just funny to me.

Speaker 2: 17:15

Yeah. Like like Literal. I now think they're unreliable.

Speaker 1: 17:19

I don't know.

Speaker 3: 17:19

I'm sorry. I don't wanna throw

Speaker 2: 17:21

a shade on here. Trust us.

Speaker 3: 17:22

It's like trust us. Believe me. Believe me.

Speaker 1: 17:25

Guys, totally reliable. Don't worry about it.

Speaker 2: 17:28

We're good. Good to

Speaker 1: 17:29

see you. Yeah. Yeah. No. Those are all good things and I agree and that's that was my that was my draw to that whole thing as well.

Speaker 1: 17:36

The other thing for me was you can have whatever computer you want to be the thing that you use to connect to your actual like computation in the cloud or whatever. Right? So for me that was like the experiment. I was like, can I just use like this this shitty tablet that Google released that then they dropped like two years later? It's so stupid.

Speaker 1: 17:55

But they cancel products so often. It's crazy. But yeah, like that's that's the other cool thing. It's like, if I break this, you know, I have a Mac mini. Actually, This is a great example.

Speaker 1: 18:06

I have a Lenovo PC that we bought to make videos and to stream. I'm not using it right now because it broke. It just broke. I don't know what it is. Maybe like the memory broke, maybe motherboard.

Speaker 1: 18:19

Now, I guess it's a different use case. But the idea is with like thin client, like, you don't care if your stuff breaks because it was just the $200 piece of crap hardware. You just get another one. It's not a big deal, you know. And then I

Speaker 3: 18:30

guess I do spend a lot of time keeping my Mac Studio, like my desktop computer and my MacBook in sync. Like I had to push my dot file Yeah. You know, all this stuff. And if I had it all in one central location, that that makes sense.

Speaker 1: 18:44

According to Twitter, Nix will fix that for you. Nix? Nix OS will fix that.

Speaker 2: 18:48

It will. It it will. You get it. You set it up. You learn it.

Speaker 2: 18:51

And then one month later, you forget how it works entirely and you can never update anything again until you spend another Yeah. Month of That's true.

Speaker 3: 18:59

It's basically my Niobem.

Speaker 2: 19:00

By even NeoVM, other people use it. So you can like, you know

Speaker 3: 19:03

Yeah. That's true.

Speaker 2: 19:04

Get some help.

Speaker 1: 19:05

The next is next is wild.

Speaker 2: 19:07

It's so good. It's such a good idea packaged in like the worst product decisions ever. And it's so tragic to me because it could be great and it could be something that every single developer uses but

Speaker 1: 19:16

I see the potential too. I totally see it. And it's just like, yeah, having like this declarative way to say like, I want all of this stuff on my machine and then so you can just move that to another machine and then it just installs everything that it needs and it's all like the same exact setup. Like that makes so much sense. But like flakes are a are a are a unstable, you know, like not a not a not a what's the word?

Speaker 1: 19:38

It's not like a 1.0 release. Like it's still a beta thing. And that's the whole entire ecosystem of NICS relies on an unstable like piece of the software. And so it's just and like the documentation is all over the place. You read up on one piece of documentation, but it's like actually, you know, six months old.

Speaker 1: 19:55

So it's like a whole different syntax now and like it's it's it's just all over the place. It's hard.

Speaker 3: 19:59

So I I don't appreciate you guys talking bad about Knicks. They gave me Knicks for free if I talk about them.

Speaker 1: 20:06

And I know I just

Speaker 3: 20:07

I threw shade on your sponsor, Dax.

Speaker 1: 20:08

And by the way, they're totally reliable.

Speaker 3: 20:11

Totally reliable. Reliable, Nicks. I found.

Speaker 2: 20:15

Yeah. That's funny. So, Adam, you should ask you should consider just I mean, if you wanna try it out, just make your Mac Studio the server and try the staging from your

Speaker 3: 20:26

Yeah. Guess that's the thing.

Speaker 2: 20:27

I should

Speaker 3: 20:27

make cause I just put a Mac mini in my server rack. Do you guys do you do a home lab? I know Dax says Typecraft,

Speaker 2: 20:32

do you

Speaker 1: 20:33

do No. Home lab don't. Okay. I because I have was when I was a lot younger, but I haven't done that in a long time.

Speaker 3: 20:38

Me and Dax have recently I don't know how recently you did Dax.

Speaker 2: 20:41

I've been honest off. I originally started with the Rack of servers in my parents basement. That's a ten

Speaker 3: 20:45

year My year ago.

Speaker 2: 20:46

My guy gave me. Yeah. Yeah. So what do

Speaker 1: 20:48

you what do you use the home lab for? What's the What do you test the lab?

Speaker 2: 20:51

He can't he can't say publicly because it's illegal, but you can infer.

Speaker 3: 20:55

That sounds awful.

Speaker 1: 20:57

It's not that illegal, but it is illegal. Okay. I'm just stealing some WiFi passwords. Don't worry about it. No.

Speaker 3: 21:06

I use it for other stuff. I used to use I can't remember anything else. There's definitely some other stuff. Pye hole. I had a pie hole.

Speaker 1: 21:14

Yeah. Yeah.

Speaker 3: 21:16

Oh, you guys got me all thrown off.

Speaker 1: 21:17

No. No. No. You're you're serving up media. You're just serving up media.

Speaker 2: 21:20

Yeah. That's all.

Speaker 3: 21:21

It's not legal.

Speaker 1: 21:22

Serve up some media. No big deal.

Speaker 3: 21:24

Yeah. So I just put a Mac mini in my server rack because I had an old one. I'm using a Mac Studio now.

Speaker 2: 21:29

Did you get a new one?

Speaker 3: 21:30

No. No. No. This is my like, the machine. It's an m one.

Speaker 3: 21:34

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So it's nearly not nearly as powerful as my current desktop, but I'd have to switch them. If I do this server setup Mhmm.

Speaker 3: 21:40

I'd wanna put my powerful one in the server rack and use my dumb one out here. Right?

Speaker 2: 21:44

And you don't have to physically move anything around at all because like What are you talking about? Why not? Physically move your studio into

Speaker 3: 21:49

the because it would be the server computer. Doesn't

Speaker 2: 21:52

have in to the server rack. Like, I'm sure you started a bunch of stuff to plug into it, like all your mics and cameras and stuff. So, I don't know if you can really switch it.

Speaker 3: 22:02

Well, then what would change? I'm so confused.

Speaker 1: 22:04

Would I actually be using

Speaker 3: 22:06

This is what my keyboard is now. Have

Speaker 1: 22:08

use it. I don't know what to tell you.

Speaker 2: 22:10

It's still a server if it's not a server rack, Adam. Just SSH into your Mac Studio from your MacBook.

Speaker 3: 22:15

Oh, that's

Speaker 1: 22:15

I don't

Speaker 2: 22:15

know how often you use your MacBook either, but

Speaker 3: 22:17

I do sometimes. Last night, sat in the bath with my MacBook. Is that weird? Do guys you ever

Speaker 1: 22:22

do that? Taking a bath is weird as a in general. The MacBook's kind of a a different thing. Don't yeah. I think that one's fine.

Speaker 3: 22:33

I take baths. I mean, only like for enjoyment. I don't take them to clean myself.

Speaker 1: 22:37

Right. Okay. That makes sense. Yeah.

Speaker 3: 22:39

Yeah. I take a shower every night. I take a shower right after I take a bath. Oh, because you get all sweaty and gross in a bath, you turn it up real hot. Anyway.

Speaker 1: 22:45

Mhmm. Mhmm.

Speaker 3: 22:47

Yeah. I use my backpack some, but I use it a lot more

Speaker 2: 22:50

when SSH from the bathtub is what we're saying.

Speaker 3: 22:52

So, I SSH to my Mac Studio. So then my Mac Mini, I don't even need to do anything with. Yeah. Okay. From the bathtub.

Speaker 2: 22:59

Got it. You should try this setup. For me, it was a little the other reasoning was I've just gone through so many Linux laptops and I just did not like any of them that much. Like they would just degrade really quickly or I don't know. I just never like got to a set a setup I loved.

Speaker 2: 23:14

I was always like, damn, the MacBook hardware is just unbeatable. Like, the CPU itself is really good and like display and the battery, think it just comes together nicely. Just don't wanna use Mac OS.

Speaker 1: 23:23

It is great. Yeah.

Speaker 2: 23:25

That was another reason why I We lost

Speaker 3: 23:27

on the last part. I love Mac OS. But but everything else, I'm spot on. Mac hardware, great. It's excellent.

Speaker 1: 23:33

Mac OS is a lot easier to use than Windows.

Speaker 3: 23:35

It is a lot easier to use than Windows and Linux.

Speaker 2: 23:38

Is full of ads now. Feel like because I still I dual boot, so I go into Windows when I, know, play games and stuff. But Mhmm. Which again, I don't even do that anymore because I now remote for that as well. But it's just full of ads.

Speaker 2: 23:50

Like, you open anything and it's just like an ad for something everywhere. And I'm like, when did this happen to Windows and why is it just always trying to get me to buy some random thing?

Speaker 1: 23:58

It's horrible.

Speaker 2: 23:58

It feels really weird.

Speaker 1: 23:59

Yeah. Windows is terrible. We used it I used a PC for a little while for like the streaming and stuff. Now I'm on the Mac studio. But yeah, no.

Speaker 1: 24:06

When I when I had the PC up and running while I was using it, I had the same problems, all ads and stuff. And then somebody put it really well on Twitter. Like, it was the most perfect definition of what happens with Windows. It's like every every couple of days or so, if you restart it, it'll act like it's the first time it booted up. And, like, they'll install all these updates and, like, tell you all about the new stuff and you're like, I know what the I know what the fuck I'm doing here.

Speaker 1: 24:29

Like, I just like just I'm open OBS. Like, let's go. Let's go. It's it's so true. Windows is just so odd.

Speaker 2: 24:37

It's like, do you wanna use Bing? Like, are you sure you definitely don't need Chrome? You can use Internet Explorer or Edge like for sure. And then they're like selling you their cloud drive thing and yeah.

Speaker 1: 24:45

It definitely installed a this sounds like such a boomer thing to happen to me, but it definitely installed on Chrome something that made because I just searched I just go into like the web

Speaker 2: 25:00

The URL bar.

Speaker 1: 25:00

Tool bar up top. Yeah. URL bar. Yeah. And I just type for searching.

Speaker 1: 25:03

Right? And that always defaults to like Google or whatever. I'm using not Bing. We'll see the other one. Duck, duck, go.

Speaker 1: 25:09

Yeah. And something happened where Chrome was all of a sudden using Yahoo for search. And I was like, what happened? I I threw that on Twitter too, people were making fun of me. But then somebody was like, it's probably McAfee.

Speaker 1: 25:22

And sure enough, like, the Mac I had McAfee on it because they install it on Windows. Like, McAfee will default your search to Yahoo from whatever.

Speaker 3: 25:30

It's insane. It's That is one of the funniest things I've ever heard in my life.

Speaker 1: 25:34

It's insane. I was like, I know I solved this problem for my parents when I was like 12. Like, I know this isn't I didn't do this,

Speaker 2: 25:42

you know. You guys remember that when

Speaker 1: 25:44

they had like eight toolbars?

Speaker 2: 25:47

That was the main thing that viruses would do. They would just add it to war and change your search engine, basically. Yeah. It's funny. I feel like the whole ecosystem is just full of, like, extremely convoluted and, like, cursed business models where it's like, okay, we're gonna build antivirus software but we're not actually gonna make any money off the antivirus virus software.

Speaker 2: 26:03

It's just gonna change the people's search engine and the author's gonna pay us. It's just like these crazy systems that are just yeah, just I don't know.

Speaker 1: 26:11

It's full of full of grifters.

Speaker 2: 26:12

Yeah. It's just a it's a total mess. But I mean, I still I mean, all my development started out in Windows.

Speaker 1: 26:18

Mhmm.

Speaker 2: 26:19

Visual Studio Mhmm. Not code. The OG, of course. Mhmm. Heavy, heavy, big boy.

Speaker 3: 26:26

Download it through MSDN. Your MSDN subscription that I did

Speaker 2: 26:31

dad had like the binder full of MSDN like

Speaker 1: 26:34

Oh, yeah.

Speaker 2: 26:34

To buy like the enterprise thing, they give you all the CDs with all the

Speaker 1: 26:38

Oh, that's so cool.

Speaker 2: 26:39

It was

Speaker 3: 26:39

like every piece of software they've ever made. You get it's the like top tier, that was so cool. And I never used any of it, but it was so cool.

Speaker 2: 26:47

It was always like, here, here's a copy of like Windows and Windows, like Enterprise and Windows Enterprise. It's just like, what are the differences between these things?

Speaker 1: 26:56

Mhmm. And it was all physical media, it was like a version behind and you couldn't really update it. Yeah.

Speaker 3: 27:03

Imagine if we had to ship like software today on like a CD ROM. Like, you burned it to a CD.

Speaker 1: 27:09

Like That's tough.

Speaker 3: 27:10

Imagine the timelines and like the stress

Speaker 1: 27:12

over Yeah. Like

Speaker 2: 27:13

It's crazy. Video games used to were like that for until recently probably. Probably the last ones to shift over.

Speaker 1: 27:18

Until Steam.

Speaker 2: 27:19

Yeah. You gotta actually not ship bugs.

Speaker 3: 27:21

The web is pretty great. We can ship all kinds of bugs.

Speaker 1: 27:23

It's amazing. So many bugs. Yeah. So many wonderful bugs. Tomorrow out there.

Speaker 3: 27:27

For the next day. Just fix the bug today.

Speaker 1: 27:29

Just changing your search to Yahoo. That's just part

Speaker 2: 27:31

of the process. You ship it and then the only way to know there's a bug is when a user reports it. That's that's how the

Speaker 1: 27:36

Yeah.

Speaker 2: 27:37

That's how the

Speaker 1: 27:38

Move fast and break things, bro.

Speaker 2: 27:40

Yeah. What is your what is your setup right now? Like what is your development setup?

Speaker 3: 27:44

I was gonna ask the same thing. I wanna know like because I see all you've got videos covering all the different tools that I wish I

Speaker 2: 27:50

used Yeah.

Speaker 3: 27:50

Like in Zelda J and all these things.

Speaker 2: 27:52

Yeah. What do

Speaker 3: 27:53

you use personally? Like code editor

Speaker 1: 27:55

So or your

Speaker 3: 27:55

text editor?

Speaker 1: 27:56

This is the laptop. This is a framework like Nice. The 13 inch one.

Speaker 2: 28:00

13. Super

Speaker 1: 28:01

nice. These are lovely. I love these.

Speaker 3: 28:05

Is a sponsored episode.

Speaker 2: 28:06

Yeah. Reliable site.

Speaker 1: 28:08

Welcome to the framework Hour. Here's the thing. You can use framework with Nicks, Adam, and then SSH to a reliable server on reliable site.

Speaker 2: 28:20

There you go.

Speaker 1: 28:21

No. So here's I use that. I was using Arch for a long time and I still miss some of it. But when I did a partial upgrade, which just somehow seems to happen and I broke my machine, was like, you know what? Let me just go back to basics.

Speaker 1: 28:38

So right now I'm on I'm running Ubuntu with

Speaker 2: 28:40

Wait. My question is how often do you do the upgrades? Because I have had a calendar item in my calendar forever now, like Mhmm. Again, over ten years as Adam likes to point out. It's funny because we've been doing this for at least two years, so now it's like twelve years really.

Speaker 3: 28:55

Oh, wow. Yeah.

Speaker 2: 28:57

That says Arch update Fridays. Every Friday, I update I my

Speaker 1: 29:01

like that. So you run Arch? Yeah. You know, maybe I'm just like a bad Arch user, but for me, I was like, oh, you know, there's this new there's this new thing in Gnome 47 that was like, oh, let me just like update that and I'll try it. And I just updated

Speaker 2: 29:17

I see. I see.

Speaker 1: 29:18

I just updated Gnome and I was like, alright, cool. That's interesting. So like, whatever. Sometime later, turned off the computer, turned it back on, just got a blank screen of like, you you fucked up. You fucked up.

Speaker 1: 29:30

Fucked up. And then so so that was the second time doing it. I did it once live on stream, which led to me making a video, which is like interesting like content on using using a BTRFS file system, or as I like to call it, BATURFS to because it has like good snapshotting ability, you know. Yeah. And so I did all that stuff and it all amounted to nothing.

Speaker 1: 29:54

Because like, it just it still I'm like, I still broke my computer. So then so then yeah. So then I I just kind of I was like, yeah. I'm just gonna install Ubuntu and just move on with my life. Actually, no.

Speaker 1: 30:06

Here's what happened. I broke my computer and I was like, you know what? I've been thinking about Knicks and there's a lot of people Oh. That There's a lot of people that say Knicks will solve all my problems, you know, and and my kids will finally like me. And so I was like I was like, alright, you know, let me let me look into Nick's.

Speaker 1: 30:23

And then so I thought, you know, I'll give myself like, I don't know, six hours or so just the day just to like play around with it. And I got nowhere. And I got so frustrated that I installed Ubuntu and that's that's just where I'm at now. But it's always I have like an existential crisis every six months, so I'm gonna change that for sure. Yeah.

Speaker 1: 30:41

I don't know what yet, but yeah, I like Arch. I miss the AUR. That's the thing I miss the most.

Speaker 2: 30:46

I was just gonna say, for me, the main reason I like Linux is package management. It's great. Love it. And then Arch has like

Speaker 1: 30:55

It's a first class citizen.

Speaker 2: 30:56

Yeah. And it's it has everything you could like any random thing I need to install. Yep. It's it's just in there for some reason. I don't know why.

Speaker 2: 31:02

Some guy maintains a package for it.

Speaker 1: 31:05

It's awesome. It's such a

Speaker 2: 31:06

great setup. That's the main reason I use Arch. Probably the only reason.

Speaker 3: 31:10

Yeah. So Ubuntu, what what do you use for like, do you use TMux or ZelleJ or

Speaker 1: 31:16

Oh, yeah. So my NeoVim. Typically, it's it's NeoVim and TMux. That's that's the whole setup.

Speaker 2: 31:22

What's the from

Speaker 3: 31:24

the Ghosty. Let's go. Love Ghosty.

Speaker 1: 31:28

So cool. Mitchell's making a a hell of a terminal emulator. Really good.

Speaker 3: 31:32

Axe, you need to get in the beta, you really do.

Speaker 2: 31:34

I just I just implemented my own terminal emulator again this weekend. It's extremely slow.

Speaker 3: 31:41

Wait, you're building you're building your own?

Speaker 2: 31:43

For the second time. Wait, what? Because the SST multiplexer is a terminal emulator.

Speaker 1: 31:49

Oh, you use SST. Oh,

Speaker 3: 31:50

right. Right.

Speaker 2: 31:52

I do I do happen to use it.

Speaker 1: 31:53

Suck Suckless? No. Sorry. No. Sorry.

Speaker 1: 31:57

I got confused. We said terminals and there's one called ST that is the sockless terminal. Oh. And Oh, yes. Yeah.

Speaker 1: 32:03

And so that I'd yeah. So I got confused. Yes. SST. Right?

Speaker 2: 32:07

Yeah. So we we have the need to show multiple commands in a single process. So we have to implement our own emulator so we can we can show it. And I'm doing like a v two of it right now. So yeah, it's it's very slow.

Speaker 2: 32:22

It's good enough for us but like I opened up Neovim in it and it was like, I could feel the lag when I was hitting the keys. I'm like, I don't think anyone's gonna open Neovim in here but good to know the gaps.

Speaker 1: 32:33

What goes what goes into that? How do you start

Speaker 2: 32:36

with that? Yeah, it's it's just I mean, I know how much you've looked into this stuff but, like, there's just a set of codes that terminals understand. Codes like move the cursor to this position, change the color to this color, print this character. And you just have to like parse streams of that and then maintain federally a buffer probably in memory usually of like a grid of cells, which is like the terminal. Mhmm.

Speaker 2: 33:00

And based on the command that comes in, like do something to this to this grid in memory and you flush that out to the screen whenever whatever logic you want to use for that. So it's just an effort in really studying all of the codes and like implementing them all exactly correctly and then there's just a lot of them and some of them are like there's like the core sets that is like kind of universal, then Ghostie implements a lot of the newer cooler things like supporting images and and stuff like that. Mhmm. And there's just been like iterations over the years, some supporting like, from two fifty six color to like the full RGBA Mhmm. I'm sorry, RGB gamut.

Speaker 2: 33:40

Yeah, just interpreting these anti codes. It's actually very in terms of the actual, like, loop, it's very simple. It's just interpreting the thing, moving the cursor, doing the thing. It's just there's a lot of these codes and some of them are, like, a little weird. But it's actually a perfect thing to use LMs for because you can just ask them like, hey, what does this code do and like, you know, it's kind of obscure information but it is out there and it kind of nicely summarize it for you.

Speaker 3: 34:03

Oh, really interesting. But you're you're building I'm still so confused. You're building an emulator like that you run instead of running like the terminal app

Speaker 2: 34:12

on your app.

Speaker 1: 34:13

So the user doesn't have to install one themselves, right?

Speaker 2: 34:15

Yes. That that yeah. That that that's the issue. It was a it's like if everyone was using TMux, then we would just open all the processes as TMux, Windows, whatever and then you can just look through them. But majority of people don't and we still need to give them the ability to look through it.

Speaker 2: 34:28

So it's kind of like having t mux built into our CLI. Like a shitty t mux.

Speaker 3: 34:33

Okay. A shitty or t mux. That makes sense. Okay.

Speaker 1: 34:36

Shit mux. Shitmucks.

Speaker 3: 34:39

What so what's Zelda j? I keep saying it because I want somebody to tell me what it is.

Speaker 1: 34:43

Yeah. Exactly. Zelda j is a it's it's a terminal multiplexer very similar to TMux, but it's just way easier to actually like teach it and understand it.

Speaker 3: 34:54

Oh, it's Zellage.

Speaker 1: 34:55

Yeah. Zellage. Yeah. Zellage.

Speaker 2: 34:57

Actually Zellage.

Speaker 1: 34:58

And the video That's what

Speaker 3: 34:59

I was thinking.

Speaker 1: 35:00

And the video I made for it, I I went to some, you know, the the how do you pronounce this like YouTube videos or whatever. Mhmm. And the and the thing was wrong. It said Zalega. And I was

Speaker 2: 35:07

like, alright. We're going to learn Zalega today. That's a really good prank. You just produce a bunch of those videos and just always say it the wrong way. Yeah.

Speaker 2: 35:15

I should do that actually because that's That's his

Speaker 1: 35:17

really good. That's so funny. But no, I think yeah. Think it's a someone could correct me if I'm wrong. I think it's an Arabic word for like tile or something like mosaic like tile, like so you can place tiles.

Speaker 1: 35:29

But it's a it's like a terminal multiplex, which is like tmux. And it's just it just has really good same like defaults and the key combination sort of makes sense. And you actually have if you open up Zellej on your computer. I don't have it on this one. Otherwise, maybe I would.

Speaker 1: 35:44

But you have like a bar that shows you like push this button, you push that one and it goes into like pain mode. So you do control p goes into pain mode, and then a new bar shows up and says n would give you a new pain. And then it's like it's just a really good like almost modal.

Speaker 3: 35:58

Walk you through it.

Speaker 1: 35:59

Yeah. It's it's a pretty straightforward thing, but also has it's like more modern than TMUX, so it has a lot of the quality of life improvements that you'd want from TMUX like like automatic like session resurrection, you know, it's not like a play

Speaker 3: 36:11

button or

Speaker 1: 36:12

something. It's just something you could type a a key command and it'll open up a little like buffer window or yeah, like a floating window that has the list of your last sessions. You could resurrect them from there. You know what I mean? So it's Oh, cool.

Speaker 1: 36:24

This gets got a lot of good quality of life improvements. But, yeah, I know it's it's a really nice.

Speaker 3: 36:28

But but you don't use it like daily. Is there what's the downside of it?

Speaker 1: 36:32

It is so it it depends on your use case. So for me, I'm so used to TMux. Zellage is like, it's a it's almost modal. Right? You have to hit a a key command to go into like pain mode and then n would give you a new pain for example.

Speaker 1: 36:48

Right? But for t mux, there's no real modes. It's just like key combinate. It's just like a Yeah.

Speaker 3: 36:53

Just your leader key and

Speaker 1: 36:54

then Yeah. Leader it's leader and then a key will give you like a new thing. Right? So and then on top of that, I'm very much used to using TMUX with NeoVim. And there's two plugins that go hand in hand.

Speaker 1: 37:07

There's a VIM TMUX navigator, which is like the neo VIM piece of this. And then there's the TMUX navigation plug in. Those two together will basically say like, oh, I know that the pain you're trying to go to is a VIM pain. I'm gonna send the command that brings you into VIM. Then the VIM one will say, oh, you're trying to go to a TMUX pane right now.

Speaker 1: 37:29

So I'm gonna I'm gonna push you to the TMUX pane. So all of this together, what you can get is a nice setup where if you just hold control and your h j k l keys, it'll go up and down from t mux to vim, t mux to vim. You don't have to do it. You don't have to prepend it with control w Yes. L

Speaker 2: 37:45

or I

Speaker 3: 37:45

want this. It's I want it.

Speaker 1: 37:47

Yep. It's it's awesome. And so I've been using that for about ten years. Which is funny because actually it probably has been about ten years, but like that's that's the thing I use. And so like that's that's why I use TMux because that's Yeah.

Speaker 1: 38:02

Yeah. That is my use case. Yeah. Someone else is more comfortable with different key combinations or whatever, Zellej is way easier to learn, if that makes sense. Mhmm.

Speaker 1: 38:11

I

Speaker 2: 38:11

I I feel the same way. I just have like the muscle memory of TMux is like so calcified at this point where I'm like, even with those benefits, it's not like compelling enough for me to try to switch.

Speaker 1: 38:23

And TMux is crazy, the the key I'm

Speaker 3: 38:26

just like a year in to the TMux thing and it's not totally calcified, but I also learned bad. Somebody told me I don't remember who told me

Speaker 1: 38:34

You gotta use center for kids who could read good. You can't read good.

Speaker 2: 38:38

I learned bad. I

Speaker 1: 38:39

learned No.

Speaker 3: 38:40

Somebody told me to use leader control a. And so my TMux leader key is control a and I've been told now that that's bad. That is not the default and I don't do what everyone else does.

Speaker 2: 38:51

No. That's because when I was trying to use your computer, I was hitting control a to go to like the beginning of a bash shell thing. Yeah. And it just wasn't working. Was like, what is going on?

Speaker 2: 39:02

I was

Speaker 3: 39:02

trying to protect your identity, Dax. I wasn't trying

Speaker 2: 39:04

to Okay.

Speaker 3: 39:05

Dox that you were the one that made fun of me, but someone made fun of me.

Speaker 2: 39:08

I didn't make fun of you. Was just upset that I my what I was doing wasn't working.

Speaker 3: 39:12

I was just Like, want to have the default. I want someone to be able to sit at my laptop

Speaker 2: 39:16

and The default hit just stupid, right? It's like control b, which I always found to be kind of weird.

Speaker 1: 39:21

Yeah. It's terrible.

Speaker 2: 39:22

Yeah. Mine also doesn't make any sense. Mine's control s, which is something that I again set when I first ever used t mux. Oh, it is. Okay.

Speaker 1: 39:29

Yeah. I think that's I think that's like an accepted like that's what a lot

Speaker 2: 39:32

of people That's

Speaker 3: 39:33

the de facto? Okay. Control s?

Speaker 2: 39:34

Because control s normally freezes the screen. Right? I think that's what it normally does. It like freezes your terminal output, which I hate. Yeah.

Speaker 3: 39:42

He wants to do that.

Speaker 2: 39:42

It's like I almost always do it by accident. I forget how to unfreeze it. So Yeah. It's good that it's remapped.

Speaker 1: 39:47

Yeah. No. I yeah. I've never I don't think I've ever used control s for anything other than tmux. So yeah.

Speaker 3: 39:52

Okay. So control s would be if I wanted to be at least in Unity with this podcast episode, then control s. I just I'm getting ready to redo my NeoVim. I gotta redo all my stuff, and I wanna do it the right way. I wanna learn correct

Speaker 2: 40:05

When Adam says redo, he means he's gonna clone my dot files.

Speaker 3: 40:07

I'm gonna clone

Speaker 1: 40:08

the access dot files. It's neovision big. And I'm gonna start with Hey, next time you're in the bath with your MacBook, clone the dot files. Just have a good little, you know.

Speaker 3: 40:17

I'll just pull up some type crap videos in the bath and I'll just learn how I want to set myself up.

Speaker 2: 40:22

Does it make you uncomfortable that Adam's gonna be naked while he's watching

Speaker 1: 40:24

these speech? I assume everyone's naked when they watch me,

Speaker 2: 40:28

so it's fine. A good percentage of people are.

Speaker 1: 40:31

Yeah. I'm naked when I record videos. I just, you know, say, put clothes on me. Put clothes on me. You fix it in post production.

Speaker 1: 40:38

Yeah. My editor hates me.

Speaker 2: 40:44

Okay. So you got Ghosty, you've got TMux and you got Neovim, that's your setup. And and you you typically do Ruby, is that where you're

Speaker 1: 40:53

Yeah. No, my whole career has been Ruby on Rails with I've I've followed the gamut of JavaScript frameworks that Ruby has adopted or Rails rather.

Speaker 2: 41:02

Mhmm.

Speaker 1: 41:02

So I don't know if anyone remembers this but a little thing called jQuery. No. Just kidding. So Rails for a while, the the framework that they liked or library whatever was Backbone. Js.

Speaker 1: 41:16

Yeah. Did some Backbone stuff, which I thought was so it was just like a nice little elegant like PubSub kind of library. It was it was nice. For a while, was Ember. And so I I did a little bit of Ember for a couple of years.

Speaker 1: 41:28

And then and then by necessity, I was actually a React and Next. Js developer for years, like a few years. And I was Really? Actually, yeah. For a while, my career was more front end than full stack or back end.

Speaker 1: 41:42

Mhmm. And I did and I like having my own thing, like my own like my own business. I like, you know, having my own like stuff that I work on. So for a long time, I was a consultant, like freelance or whatever. Thing.

Speaker 1: 41:54

One of my That's clients

Speaker 2: 41:55

as well.

Speaker 1: 41:55

Oh, nice. Yeah. So one of my clients, I did a an iOS app in Dart and Flutter. Wow. Which was kind of lovely actually.

Speaker 1: 42:04

This is really nice to work with. Dart feels like JavaScript with like good good types.

Speaker 2: 42:10

Types. Yeah. But there's an alternative universe where like Dart actually stuck in the browser and like pushed out JavaScript that didn't happen.

Speaker 1: 42:17

Yeah. I like I like Dart a

Speaker 2: 42:19

lot. Blutter. Yeah. Okay. Interesting.

Speaker 3: 42:21

The the rails thing, DHH, I've I've seen him like big fan of your stuff. He says it on Twitter. Is that new? Did you know DHH from before or was

Speaker 1: 42:31

this? No. Yeah. No. We're old friends.

Speaker 3: 42:33

You guys go way back. You drove in the races together?

Speaker 1: 42:36

That that whole that whole arc of this like YouTube thing that we've been doing is that was the most that was the best part of this other than being on this podcast with you guys, of course.

Speaker 3: 42:48

I would think I would think like Rails, if you're a Rails developer, developer, he's like your Jesus.

Speaker 1: 42:53

Yeah. So yeah. He is yeah. He's my Jesus. He has a lot of hair now.

Speaker 1: 42:58

Yeah. No. So so it's it's it was amazing for me. I'll I'll I'll give you a little bit of insight. So I graduated college with computer engineering degree, which kinda like DAX probably.

Speaker 1: 43:10

I I built I built computers in high school and stuff. I like to game. And so I was like, I don't know what I wanna do with my life. I didn't know I liked software. So I was like, I just know I like computers, you know, and I hated school and I was like, whatever.

Speaker 1: 43:21

I'll just do something with computers. Maybe that'll be interesting. Computer engineering was a bad choice because it was a mix of electrical engineering and a little bit of computer science. Right? So it was really heavy electrical engineering, which was not not something I was very interested Yeah.

Speaker 1: 43:37

Somehow I graduated and I didn't know what I wanted to do. I had a couple like random jobs like a QA guy and whatever. Not to bash QA people. It just wasn't what

Speaker 3: 43:47

I like.

Speaker 2: 43:48

Stupid QA deal.

Speaker 1: 43:49

Stupid QA That's a joke job. But yeah. Working as a QA person, I worked as a company that did like kinda on-site QA yada yada yada. I worked at one company on-site where these people were making like stuff in rails. And I didn't know what this was.

Speaker 1: 44:04

I was like, oh my god. It's so cool. You could do like you can make like this thing look beautiful, but also you're like writing code to make it happen. Like, I didn't understand like the web could do that. Mhmm.

Speaker 1: 44:13

And so and so that's when I learned about Ruby on Rails ever since then. Then I saw, like, the how to make a blog in fifteen minutes video that that, you know, DHH did many years ago, about about ten years ago.

Speaker 2: 44:25

No.

Speaker 1: 44:26

More like fifteen. But he did that many years ago and so, I watched that religiously, like, over and over trying to understand, like, what is this database? What's a model? Like, what's the schema? How does how does this, like, you know, all that stuff, Templafiles?

Speaker 1: 44:39

And eventually, I got into Rails and, like, my career kind of started, like, kind of a little bit later on. It was it was it's amazing that so with that in mind, that context, me making videos on NeoVim and Zellage and like Linux, it was it was crazy that all of a sudden DHH like because I posted think the first time he reached out was yeah. 50,000 subscribers. We're at a hundred hundred hundred eight now. Recently.

Speaker 1: 45:04

Right? Yeah. Yeah. 50,000, I posted on someone Twitter and DHH said like, hey, congratulations. I love your work.

Speaker 1: 45:12

And I like, DHH knows who I am. Like, that's amazing. And then not so long after that, he DM'd me on Twitter. It was like, hey, by the way, congratulations. You're doing great stuff.

Speaker 1: 45:22

We have this conference in Toronto coming up. It's all full, but like maybe you could do like a workshop or something on like Zelle Edge and this thing that you made videos on. I was like, really? Yeah. I would love to, of course.

Speaker 1: 45:33

And so like ever since then like we got to go to Toronto and do this workshop on Zelle Edge which was equally like extremely scary, but also very, like, rewarding. And that was when, like, you know, this whole YouTube thing is still kinda new to me. It's only been, like, a year or so max. And so that was when people like, the first time someone, like, recognized me, you know? And like people like kinda lined up saying being like you wanted to like take pictures and stuff.

Speaker 1: 45:58

I'm like, this is freaking crazy. Like I

Speaker 2: 46:00

Yeah. Wow.

Speaker 1: 46:00

I didn't know anyone would ever like care about anything I'm doing. Like, is so cool. Like, like, Carrie brought me out here. And then after that, while we were there, I was like, I'd love to make videos on this Rails eight stuff. Like, all this stuff's really cool you're doing.

Speaker 1: 46:14

Like, I love this version of the framework, whatever. And and he was like, oh, you're a Rails developer? And so and so now I did I did a whole series on Rails eight that's on their YouTube channel, which is like just so nice. So yeah, this whole circle of like this this thing has just been super cool. Really,

Speaker 3: 46:35

really cool. That's a wild coincidence because he just kinda got into all this stuff and you happen to be like the YouTuber doing all this stuff this year. I mean, is there other people that do the kind of like terminal based YouTube content? I just don't

Speaker 1: 46:47

I think so. I think there's a lot. Actually, someone who I model a lot of like the video style after, this guy Network Chuck. I don't know if you guys have Oh, heard of yeah. He's super well known like that's I try and emulate a lot of what he does because I just love his videos.

Speaker 1: 47:03

He's he's so good and everything is so high quality, like everything he does. And so he does stuff like on TMux and like things like that that he's done a really good job with too. But, yeah, don't know if there's people who focus specifically on this. I know like it was funny when I first made a couple of YouTube videos on like Neovim or whatever. I would post them on Reddit and Reddit is like the meanest place in the world.

Speaker 1: 47:26

So like I posted one on Reddit and people were like, this is garbage. Like why why are you even doing this? Like everyone just go to this video or whatever and it was like one of TJ's videos on like Neofem or like sounds like That guy. I'm never I'm never gonna be like that. That's just that's that's tough.

Speaker 1: 47:42

And then so I don't know. Yeah. I'm not sure other than like, you know, I know TJ makes a lot of great New Oven videos. He did a whole series recently on all that stuff. So, yeah.

Speaker 1: 47:52

I don't know. I'm not sure. I think there's a lot of people.

Speaker 3: 47:54

Yeah. I guess, Tigeon Prime both do some like TMux y stuff. I know Bash has done some TMux stuff.

Speaker 1: 47:59

Oh, yeah. Bash. Yep. That's funny.

Speaker 3: 48:01

But, like, I guess your whole channel feels and I guess now you're doing real stuff, but it feels like if you're just into this stuff, and I feel like we all are

Speaker 2: 48:09

Yeah.

Speaker 3: 48:10

You're just if you just, like, wanna mess around with your dot file sometimes, it's like your channel's the perfect land there and learn something new that you could implement in your config.

Speaker 1: 48:19

Yeah. It's a whole yeah. It's a whole like kind of vibe of the channels like, oh, this stuff's cool. I find it super interesting. Like, check out this cool thing that I figured out like

Speaker 2: 48:26

Yeah.

Speaker 1: 48:26

Here you go. Like the, you know, Hyperland and I three and like just all that stuff. So, yeah. No. I've always found it interesting my whole entire life.

Speaker 1: 48:35

So, well, you know, my adult life.

Speaker 3: 48:38

Career,

Speaker 1: 48:38

ten years. Yeah. Whatever. About ten years. Yeah.

Speaker 1: 48:43

At some point,

Speaker 3: 48:44

we're getting pretty old. It's gonna be 20. I've got a lot of gray in this beard. We're gonna have to start saying twenty years.

Speaker 1: 48:48

I'm turning I'm turning 40 in February.

Speaker 3: 48:50

February. I'm 38, so I'm right behind you.

Speaker 1: 48:53

Yep. Yep. What about you, Dax?

Speaker 2: 48:56

I am thirty thirty three. Oh, 32. I'm 32. I'm turning 30 Are

Speaker 3: 49:03

you serious right now? I thought you were like 35. I can't believe you're actually only 32. But you're not you're not sure either.

Speaker 2: 49:13

I really have no idea right now.

Speaker 1: 49:15

I was gonna say you look great, like you look even you look younger than, you know, me and like and and of course, I guess you look appropriate.

Speaker 2: 49:22

I'm looking at AshtodgyBT. If I was born in

Speaker 3: 49:27

What year what year were you born? This is not hard.

Speaker 2: 49:30

Is it? December 2024. You weren't born in 2024. I'm '32. I'm '32.

Speaker 2: 49:37

Yeah.

Speaker 1: 49:37

I'm '32. Okay. Yeah.

Speaker 2: 49:38

I'm turning 33.

Speaker 3: 49:39

Wow. You're only 32? Did I think you were like 35?

Speaker 2: 49:42

It's not that far. It's like, it's like a three year window.

Speaker 1: 49:45

Yeah. But it's You're barely able to rent a car.

Speaker 2: 49:47

It's crazy. So we don't I just passed the part where there's stuff to look forward to. Now it's just, you

Speaker 3: 49:53

know Mhmm.

Speaker 2: 49:54

All that stuff is done. Yeah. 32. Yeah. I feel

Speaker 3: 49:58

like I'm almost ten years older than you now. I'm I'm not, but it feels like almost.

Speaker 2: 50:02

If you round up and you round me down, yeah.

Speaker 1: 50:04

Yeah. Exactly. Emotionally 10 years old. Emotionally.

Speaker 3: 50:08

Round I'm actually emotionally like a nine year old, but that's a whole another story. We'll get into that some other time.

Speaker 2: 50:13

We guess that every other podcast episode, so

Speaker 3: 50:17

Well, not not with a guest. I'm like, I'm like, know, I type crafts

Speaker 1: 50:21

through that.

Speaker 2: 50:24

Yeah. So You you brought up network Chuck and I realized why his name is familiar to me is because he also has a coffee brand.

Speaker 1: 50:32

Yes. Type graps up coffee.

Speaker 2: 50:34

It seems like you as well.

Speaker 3: 50:37

I forgot.

Speaker 2: 50:37

I hate you.

Speaker 1: 50:40

No. That one kinda it was it's funny how like things kinda fall into your lap. So, one of our earliest like community members like someone on our Discord and like someone who's like been a member of our we have a site, typegraph.dev. Don't worry about it. It's fine.

Speaker 1: 50:54

It's a reliable site. Reliable. But, you know, one of our community members, like one of the first people like, you know, you know, paid and like was like a part of the thing, wanted to support us. He just so happens to be like this awesome coffee roaster. And like for the longest time, he was like, I'd love to like make coffee for you guys.

Speaker 1: 51:11

Like, can we do this? And like, so we were on I don't know if you guys know Ghost CMS. We were on Ghost for Yeah. The first iteration of our website. So it's like very limited with what you could do.

Speaker 1: 51:20

And so Robert, my business partner, who I think you guys met in New York. He he did all this work to get us off of Ghost onto like a new Rails eight like sort of thing. So it's like a custom site now. We can do all these different Stripe integrations and all this stuff. And so like the very first thing we do, we're like, alright, let's let's do this coffee thing.

Speaker 1: 51:38

Nice. And so the first rollout is really just like if you're a member, you can add coffee as part of your subscription. So you get like Oh, a bag every month.

Speaker 3: 51:46

Oh, nice.

Speaker 1: 51:47

Yeah. It's a good price. This guy makes amazing coffee. He's he's really good. He's local

Speaker 3: 51:52

there? He's somebody you knew? He's in Kentucky. For Kentucky. Wow.

Speaker 2: 51:56

Interesting.

Speaker 1: 51:57

Yeah. So local.

Speaker 2: 51:58

But I

Speaker 1: 51:58

get I I mean, I could even give you guys his name maybe after this and I don't know if you guys want to use him too. He's he's really he makes excellent coffee.

Speaker 2: 52:06

Yeah. So but you sell it through a website? Like how does that work? Selling coffee through a website? I don't really understand that.

Speaker 2: 52:16

Do a lot of people wanna do that? Yeah.

Speaker 1: 52:22

Yeah. No. Don't know. It's it was weird. It was a weird choice on our end, you know.

Speaker 1: 52:26

Like it wasn't Yeah. You know, a website is like, who does that anymore? It's very like it's very like 2018, right? Like, who cares?

Speaker 2: 52:36

It's funny because we initially were like, okay, we'll do like the terminal thing for like a little bit and then like probably we'll eventually roll out a website. Yeah. And now it just became a thing where we're like, we had we we we we like never wanna do a website. Let's just see how far we can go with just sticking to the terminal, making that a bit.

Speaker 1: 52:53

It's so cool. Like it's such an awesome thing you guys. I can't imagine this the the Stripe integration you had to build for that though. That must have been really difficult.

Speaker 3: 53:03

Do wanna talk about it, Axe?

Speaker 1: 53:04

It wasn't.

Speaker 3: 53:05

It wasn't.

Speaker 2: 53:06

It just wasn't. Yeah. Because I mean the way it works is, you know how Stripe gives you all those like front end libraries in JavaScript to just capture and everything happens in the browser and then with their server and they just give you a token at the end? It's actually the exact same thing. So they obviously don't make like they only wrap that in a JavaScript library, so we can make those same calls directly as well.

Speaker 2: 53:27

Oh. So we still just get back a token, the credit card goes straight to Stripe, we get back a token then we like the same way that it's done on web.

Speaker 1: 53:34

That's so cool. That's what I was thinking too. Was like, because because Stripe, you just use their JavaScript thing and it just you don't worry about it. But I Yeah. If it's that

Speaker 2: 53:42

easy, It's that's the same flow. Yeah. I mean, we'll probably eventually we'll let like a browser pop open and connect it that way if you want. But yeah, it works for now. At some point, they might say like this is not kosher and they might force us to do the browser thing but until then, we're okay.

Speaker 3: 54:01

But it's it's super secure. It's safe

Speaker 2: 54:03

and reliable. And reliable.

Speaker 3: 54:05

You can still buy coffee

Speaker 2: 54:06

from terminal dot shop. No.

Speaker 1: 54:09

I mean, yeah. No. You guys are all engineers. You know what you're doing. It's just it's it's such a cool that's such a cool thing though.

Speaker 1: 54:14

It's it's really neat.

Speaker 2: 54:15

Yeah. It's been fun.

Speaker 3: 54:16

We're getting ready to roll out an API TypeCraft. It's gonna you can like buy coffee through our API and then put it in your apps or whatever. I don't know. Really?

Speaker 2: 54:25

Yeah.

Speaker 1: 54:25

That's awesome.

Speaker 2: 54:26

And and it's like it's very over over engineer is not the right word but it's like way too official. There's like Yeah. Personal access tokens and you can like create your own terminal app with the client ID and a secret and then OAuth. You know, we have a we have a OAuth. We have official SDKs even for Java that Yeah.

Speaker 2: 54:45

Adam is publishing to Maven.

Speaker 1: 54:48

Literally. That's awesome. No, that's that's how you do it though. That's so cool. That's that's that's really neat.

Speaker 2: 54:53

Instead of like having proper subscription functionality where it's gonna tell you to generate a personal access token and create a cron job for yourself.

Speaker 1: 55:01

That's so cool. I love that. That's I mean, that's that's hilarious, but I mean, it's kind of a cool setup. Or you have a calendar reminder, right?

Speaker 2: 55:08

Yes. There you go.

Speaker 1: 55:09

Yeah. Upgrade Arch and order cotton.

Speaker 2: 55:13

I'm gonna publish an Arch package where whenever you install it, it orders. Just orders another bag. Whenever you update it.

Speaker 1: 55:19

Just straight up now where?

Speaker 3: 55:22

I know I know we got off the Arch conversation, but I just have to say my story with Arch. I almost used Arch and I couldn't do the I the bootloader's You

Speaker 2: 55:30

didn't almost use

Speaker 3: 55:31

used it. Okay? If you didn't install,

Speaker 2: 55:34

you didn't almost

Speaker 3: 55:35

use said almost. I would have used it if I got

Speaker 2: 55:38

Oh, you you you only mean you almost used it once. Like, that's what you mean.

Speaker 3: 55:41

No. Almost used it one time, but the bootloader step, I failed to install something about the bootloader, and I was reading the docs. They were so good. And

Speaker 2: 55:50

I still It's because you probably went the grub route instead of the system boot route.

Speaker 1: 55:53

Classic. I don't wanna I

Speaker 3: 55:55

don't wanna resurrect it and figure out what happened. I just I'm at peace. I'm not an Arch user.

Speaker 1: 56:02

Yeah. Well, the did you use the installer script? The Arch install script? Or was it I don't remember. Manual way.

Speaker 2: 56:08

I think it was just manual.

Speaker 3: 56:09

That felt like difficult. It is difficult. Thank you. I felt like if I'm gonna

Speaker 2: 56:13

do because this I'm gonna do it if you're not a moron.

Speaker 3: 56:17

I felt like it was like the earn your stripes, like you gotta do the hard way. And then it's like a lot

Speaker 1: 56:23

people look at it that way. Yeah.

Speaker 2: 56:24

For sure. You learn a lot about how it works. That's why it's worth When doing

Speaker 3: 56:29

it doesn't work and then you don't learn anything because you just never use Arch. You

Speaker 2: 56:33

weren't meant to go. Just you personally weren't meant to go. That's it. Look, listen. Every other engineer at terminal uses Linux and you don't.

Speaker 3: 56:43

Am I the only met? Well, David doesn't. Oh, engineer. I see.

Speaker 2: 56:46

He's a he's a designer. Even Liz uses Linux. Yes. Even Liz uses Linux.

Speaker 1: 56:50

Nice. Hell

Speaker 2: 56:51

yeah. And Tmux, any of them.

Speaker 3: 56:53

So Oh, man.

Speaker 1: 56:54

You're you're

Speaker 2: 56:55

actually the most casual engineer. I'm the front end.

Speaker 1: 56:57

This is the front end engineer.

Speaker 2: 56:59

I'm the

Speaker 3: 56:59

front end developer. Leave me alone.

Speaker 1: 57:01

Mhmm. Yeah.

Speaker 3: 57:02

Drink soy lattes and I work on a Mac and a battery.

Speaker 2: 57:04

You're front engineer that works on a Go SSH front end.

Speaker 1: 57:08

Soy boy. Oh, we're hey, we're both soy boys. I haven't mentioned that one.

Speaker 3: 57:12

Yeah. That's right. Plant based. Right? Yep.

Speaker 1: 57:14

Mhmm. A 100%.

Speaker 3: 57:15

You. Now we're we're out what's the word? Outvoting DAX on this part? I don't know what I'm Out going representing. There are more plant eaters than meat eaters.

Speaker 2: 57:24

Yes. But I eat so much meat that I make up for He makes up guys.

Speaker 3: 57:27

He eats steak like three

Speaker 1: 57:28

times Ew, a dude. Ew, dude. Ew, Hey, walk hey, get to the twenty first century, pal. Yeah.

Speaker 2: 57:36

Well, it's funny because literally if you trace my ancestors, 100% vegetarian for like three thousand years. And then

Speaker 1: 57:43

And then you.

Speaker 3: 57:44

And then

Speaker 2: 57:44

there's 3,000 a day.

Speaker 1: 57:46

You had to put an end to it. You had to put an end

Speaker 2: 57:48

to it. Yeah. Know. I'm going the other way.

Speaker 1: 57:50

I do it. I mean, it's it's not really it's not even like an ethical thing. It's more like it's just straight up like healthier. You know, it's just like, you know,

Speaker 3: 57:57

I That's why we started. I mean, just for

Speaker 2: 57:59

our health.

Speaker 3: 58:01

Vaxx debate that heavily.

Speaker 1: 58:02

I've had times I've had times where I'm on and off, you know, but like there was it's just such a you could you could measure it because I I had a doctor's appointment where, all my blood work was like, it was okay, but it was like all everything kinda high, and they're like, oh, we gotta look out for this, gotta look out for that. And that was that was, you know, a period of my life was kinda like eating like shit. And I was like, you know what? I'm gonna turn this thing around. I love I love eating vegan.

Speaker 1: 58:26

I've done it before. I'll just I'll just go like more, you know, 100% on it. And so I did that and like in three months, everything dropped so drastically that I was like way out of the, you know, I don't

Speaker 2: 58:36

know what

Speaker 1: 58:36

you call it. The risk zone. The risk zone. Yeah. Exactly.

Speaker 1: 58:39

So like, it's a measurable effect. At least for me, it's like, yeah, there's there's no way that's not a healthy, you know, lifestyle or way to eat. So let's stick with it.

Speaker 3: 58:48

That's how I feel.

Speaker 1: 58:49

Yeah. And I lost 40 pounds.

Speaker 2: 58:51

I'm I'm just gonna make sure that Adam dies before me, then then I'll be right. I'm convinced he's gonna die before me.

Speaker 3: 58:59

Well, I'm ten years older than you, so probably.

Speaker 1: 59:02

Hey, he's got that.

Speaker 2: 59:02

You're not ten years older than me.

Speaker 3: 59:05

Rounded. Rounded down. About

Speaker 2: 59:07

than me.

Speaker 1: 59:07

About ten

Speaker 2: 59:08

years older. I'm down to five.

Speaker 3: 59:09

Me and you, both similar age. Yeah. We both use TMux and NeoVim. Yeah. We're both plant based and we both work for sports technology companies.

Speaker 1: 59:18

That's true.

Speaker 3: 59:18

That's kind of crazy.

Speaker 1: 59:19

That's very true. Yeah. It is pretty nice.

Speaker 3: 59:21

Like, we're basically the

Speaker 2: 59:21

same And you're both tall.

Speaker 1: 59:23

We're both tall. Both handsome

Speaker 2: 59:24

and white.

Speaker 3: 59:25

Both handsome

Speaker 1: 59:26

and white. Man,

Speaker 3: 59:29

I have a mustache. I just also have a beard.

Speaker 1: 59:31

Yeah. You We have a mustache with extra.

Speaker 3: 59:33

Yeah. Got all the other stuff.

Speaker 1: 59:34

You know what though? I can't grow a beard. Really?

Speaker 2: 59:37

Like But you grow that mustache and you can't grow the rest of it? The mustache

Speaker 1: 59:40

is great. Could grow a hell of a goatee. This stuff doesn't show up.

Speaker 3: 59:43

Really?

Speaker 2: 59:44

Have you like really tried like going for months without?

Speaker 1: 59:48

Yeah, it's gross.

Speaker 2: 59:49

Okay. It's gross. Because for me, I used to have right here, bald spots on each Yeah. Like a perfect circle. And I was like, this sucks.

Speaker 2: 59:57

And then one day it just went away. I just like I just like stuck through it and I looked horrible for like a couple weeks and then if my body figured it out

Speaker 1: 01:00:04

Yeah. That was probably you're still like I feel like you're still you were young enough then probably. I mean, I don't know how long ago was this for you?

Speaker 2: 01:00:11

Yeah. Was like right what I was like 20 probably.

Speaker 1: 01:00:14

Yeah. Yeah. Okay. I'm almost 40. I don't think this is gonna change anytime soon for me.

Speaker 1: 01:00:18

Yeah. Probably not. Also, have something else in common. You you still do jujitsu?

Speaker 3: 01:00:25

Yeah. I did jujitsu

Speaker 1: 01:00:27

for three months.

Speaker 3: 01:00:28

You did

Speaker 1: 01:00:28

jujitsu? Recently. For three months.

Speaker 3: 01:00:31

Like you just started?

Speaker 1: 01:00:32

No. I did it. It was last year. I did it for a while.

Speaker 3: 01:00:36

I And you got hurt.

Speaker 1: 01:00:38

I bruised ribs. Mhmm. Yeah. Like, just yeah. It's awesome.

Speaker 1: 01:00:44

I love Jiu Jitsu.

Speaker 3: 01:00:45

I pulled like a rib muscle or something and maybe kind of like lodge dislodge a rib in a competition. That was tough. Oh. The rib stuff, not fun. The breathing Not

Speaker 1: 01:00:55

fun at all.

Speaker 3: 01:00:56

No. Turns out you breathe all day.

Speaker 2: 01:00:57

Yeah. So

Speaker 3: 01:00:58

it's not fun when you it hurts to breathe.

Speaker 1: 01:01:00

Yeah. It's a lot.

Speaker 3: 01:01:01

But jujitsu too, wow. This is amazing.

Speaker 1: 01:01:03

That's crazy. Both have kids.

Speaker 3: 01:01:05

I'm I'm gonna have I get kinda tired in the podcast sometimes, to be honest. I'm gonna have typecrab just take

Speaker 2: 01:01:09

my Playstacks, if that's cool. I wouldn't even notice.

Speaker 3: 01:01:12

You probably wouldn't. I don't think anybody would. Oh, you have kids. We didn't talk about your family. You have, like, how

Speaker 1: 01:01:18

many have kids do have? We both have have twins. They're five years old, boy and girl twins. Wow. And actually, we're expecting our third kid in April.

Speaker 1: 01:01:28

Oh, wow. So we're pregnant right now.

Speaker 3: 01:01:30

Busy times. Yep.

Speaker 1: 01:01:32

Hell yeah.

Speaker 3: 01:01:32

Yeah. It's a lot. So five years apart, that's like like my kids. I have a nine year old, almost 10

Speaker 2: 01:01:37

Mhmm.

Speaker 3: 01:01:37

And a five year old. I'll I'll spare you the how that's going. It's not going great. They don't play well together with that age gap. But you have you have a different situation because you have twins at five years, older kids.

Speaker 3: 01:01:53

So they'll probably it'll work out. You'll be fine.

Speaker 1: 01:01:55

Yeah. And it's it's boy and girl and I think like our our daughter's very very girly and our our son's very very boyish and they don't play well together at all either. They're very they butt heads all the time. Yeah. But the two of them, I think, like collectively think that they're such big kids because this new baby's coming.

Speaker 1: 01:02:10

They're gonna be like, oh, little babies. So I'm hoping that they're like, you know, more of

Speaker 3: 01:02:13

the They'll be helpful.

Speaker 1: 01:02:14

Yeah. They'll be more helpful.

Speaker 2: 01:02:15

That's what I was like. Yeah. My brother's 10 younger than me, so

Speaker 1: 01:02:19

Oh, nice.

Speaker 2: 01:02:20

It was just like a baby Mhmm. Or something like a

Speaker 1: 01:02:23

Exactly. I want

Speaker 3: 01:02:24

to know how many times we've said ten years on this podcast episode. We've just drilled that, like, into the ground.

Speaker 2: 01:02:29

And that you weren't even We started using the word decade.

Speaker 1: 01:02:32

Decade? You're fast to

Speaker 2: 01:02:33

get in room gravitas. About a decade. Yeah. Wow. So you two are basically the same person?

Speaker 3: 01:02:38

Basically.

Speaker 2: 01:02:39

How does it feel to not be very unique or special at all?

Speaker 1: 01:02:43

Known this about myself for many years. Right. About ten years. Been a white

Speaker 3: 01:02:47

guy my whole lifetime.

Speaker 1: 01:02:51

I've been a white our whole life. I've never been to the Ozarks, so there's that. Oh. You've been to the East Coast. I've never been to

Speaker 2: 01:02:58

There's no reason to go.

Speaker 3: 01:02:59

There's no reason There's to really not.

Speaker 1: 01:03:02

Why are so Genuinely. Were you born around Oh, yeah. You said your family's from there, yeah.

Speaker 3: 01:03:07

I I have always lived in like 60 mile radius, so Dax isn't wrong on that. But I have traveled some.

Speaker 2: 01:03:13

He's never seen the ocean.

Speaker 1: 01:03:15

Never seen the ocean. Well, they have a big lake there.

Speaker 3: 01:03:18

You don't need to see the Yeah. There's lots of lakes. Mhmm. Caves.

Speaker 2: 01:03:23

You have seen the ocean though. I've seen you But see the that but that was a gulf. That was a gulf.

Speaker 1: 01:03:29

That was gulf though. Yeah. Golfs don't count.

Speaker 3: 01:03:31

Oh, that doesn't count.

Speaker 2: 01:03:32

Yeah. Yeah. That's just where oil companies

Speaker 1: 01:03:35

make spells in gulfs. That's Nothing special about those.

Speaker 2: 01:03:39

Have you been to an ocean ocean? I guess you've been to was just in New York. But

Speaker 3: 01:03:45

yeah, I've been to the East Coast. I've been to Southern California. I had lived in Southern California.

Speaker 2: 01:03:49

But have you been to the ocean when you were there? Okay. You're right. You did you did live there.

Speaker 3: 01:03:53

Yes. We spent time on we've lived in Playa Del Rey on the ocean for like

Speaker 2: 01:03:57

Playa means ocean. Okay. It means bees.

Speaker 3: 01:03:59

Was it? I didn't know that actually.

Speaker 2: 01:04:03

Whole time you lived there, you were just like

Speaker 3: 01:04:04

I had no idea.

Speaker 2: 01:04:05

Playa. Okay.

Speaker 1: 01:04:06

Playa Of The Rays. Yeah. I

Speaker 3: 01:04:09

just thought it was a I don't know. Is that a Spanish word? Spanish for ocean?

Speaker 1: 01:04:12

Spanish for a whale's vagina. I had to make a joke. Don't know.

Speaker 2: 01:04:16

It was

Speaker 1: 01:04:16

right there. It was just right there.

Speaker 2: 01:04:19

Adam's met never met someone that spoke Spanish before. He's never heard

Speaker 3: 01:04:24

Spanish stuff up now. We had Casey's making

Speaker 2: 01:04:27

stuff up from the beginning of this episode.

Speaker 3: 01:04:29

It's really true. From the beginning of this podcast, really.

Speaker 2: 01:04:32

You're gonna say I have friends that are

Speaker 1: 01:04:33

I have friends that

Speaker 3: 01:04:35

are Spanish? Casey's best friend speaks fluent Spanish. Her parents are from Mexico and she lived with us twice. So there you go. I know more Spanish than you, probably.

Speaker 2: 01:04:44

And and what did she do when she lived with you?

Speaker 3: 01:04:46

What are you talking about? What do you mean? She lived her life.

Speaker 2: 01:04:49

Okay. What

Speaker 3: 01:04:50

what what are you talking about? She wasn't our, like, our

Speaker 1: 01:04:52

maid. Is that what you're implying?

Speaker 3: 01:04:57

Okay. Actually, second time we

Speaker 1: 01:04:58

did pay her used to

Speaker 3: 01:05:00

stuff her in the house.

Speaker 1: 01:05:00

Oh my god. Yes. That's awesome. That's so fucking good.

Speaker 2: 01:05:05

I can't believe how it's it's funny because like, it's what I'm suggesting is actually not true but like the way you told all that.

Speaker 1: 01:05:15

For a while. Oh my

Speaker 2: 01:05:17

god. Then we tamed her.

Speaker 1: 01:05:18

She happened to clean the kitchen a lot and gave her some money

Speaker 3: 01:05:21

for her.

Speaker 1: 01:05:21

It felt bad. I might have lived in

Speaker 3: 01:05:23

prison between the the you talking about what I do with my home lab.

Speaker 1: 01:05:28

The illegal home lab? The illegal lab in The Ozarks.

Speaker 3: 01:05:31

This episode

Speaker 2: 01:05:31

has been

Speaker 3: 01:05:32

very incriminating. I just okay.

Speaker 1: 01:05:34

You probably have the most legal illegal lab in The Ozarks. It's totally legal.

Speaker 2: 01:05:38

That's very true. There's a lot of labs. Illegal lab.

Speaker 3: 01:05:41

There are a lot of lab. That's right. Not the legal kind.

Speaker 2: 01:05:45

Do you guys ever hear explosions just like from the woods?

Speaker 3: 01:05:48

So but true story. My dad was in law enforcement, like, growing up for like thirty five years. Was a Missouri State Highway Patrolman. And he has definitely run up on some like, they've Yeah. Found meth labs.

Speaker 3: 01:06:03

Not that exploded, not that dramatic. But then also, I remember stories of, like, them finding giant stockpiles of marijuana and like they dispose of them and they just light this like giant bonfire. I'm like, how is that?

Speaker 2: 01:06:16

And they got super high.

Speaker 3: 01:06:18

They're all rating super high.

Speaker 2: 01:06:19

Yeah. Party right there.

Speaker 3: 01:06:21

Like, that's just sounds like a movie or something.

Speaker 2: 01:06:23

Whole perk

Speaker 1: 01:06:24

of the job. Exactly.

Speaker 2: 01:06:28

So it's out in Ozarks. It's a bunch of people making meth and then Adam. That's basically what's in my head. I'm just like, whenever I picture Adam, it's just like woods, I think mountains.

Speaker 3: 01:06:39

Meth hills.

Speaker 2: 01:06:40

Meth trailers and then just Adam with his like MacBook Studio or Mac Studio and his his Mac mini server rack.

Speaker 3: 01:06:47

Amateur lights.

Speaker 2: 01:06:49

It's like it's all all these companies are like, we never shipped to this location before.

Speaker 3: 01:06:53

Yeah. Yeah.

Speaker 1: 01:06:55

It's kind of I'm sure it's lovely out there. I've never been.

Speaker 3: 01:06:57

It's really not, but yeah. Okay. It's kind

Speaker 1: 01:06:59

of you to say. Alright.

Speaker 2: 01:07:02

No. I'm sure I'm sure the nature the nature must be nice.

Speaker 3: 01:07:04

No. Yeah. There there's a lot of like if you enjoy the outdoors, I think a lot of people enjoy the Ozarks But

Speaker 2: 01:07:10

Adam does not, by the way.

Speaker 1: 01:07:11

I don't.

Speaker 3: 01:07:11

Yeah. I kinda hate the outdoors. So that's hence the the problem with The Ozarks.

Speaker 1: 01:07:16

Holy shit. That's awesome.

Speaker 2: 01:07:18

If you

Speaker 1: 01:07:18

hate the outdoors, you're a software engineer. Mhmm. And you're in The Ozarks.

Speaker 3: 01:07:23

And I live in The Ozarks. Yeah. It's kind of a a weird dichotomy.

Speaker 2: 01:07:26

Adam referred to himself as an indoorsman, which I think is just so funny. Yeah. I'm an indoorsman.

Speaker 1: 01:07:31

That's me too. I mean, I'm totally an indoorsman as well.

Speaker 2: 01:07:34

I think

Speaker 3: 01:07:34

most of us are, right?

Speaker 1: 01:07:35

I'm an indoorsman.

Speaker 3: 01:07:37

Yeah. What what's the it was coding horror. For a long time, his bio said indoor enthusiast.

Speaker 1: 01:07:44

Oh, nice. Yeah. Oh, yeah.

Speaker 2: 01:07:46

Yeah. I'm really in a dark room right now. Like, this is the most indoor you can possibly get. Just in blackness.

Speaker 3: 01:07:53

Taking vitamin D supplements?

Speaker 1: 01:07:55

Like

Speaker 2: 01:07:55

You know, I stopped I stopped after I moved to Miami, stopped taking vitamin D supplements.

Speaker 3: 01:07:59

Yeah. I bet you did. You're outside all day in your boxers, getting the sun.

Speaker 2: 01:08:03

Yep. I'm in my boxers right now. You can't tell.

Speaker 3: 01:08:04

I know you're in your boxers because I we in New York, there was like 10 of us in that apartment and you walked out at like 9AM every day in your boxers.

Speaker 1: 01:08:12

Oh my god. That was normal. That's awesome. Oh, guys. Wait.

Speaker 1: 01:08:15

What happened with the the Twitch stream on that thing? I was watching it was after the show The next day, NeoVimConf or whatever.

Speaker 3: 01:08:23

Oh, NeoVimConf.

Speaker 1: 01:08:24

Yeah. Yeah. Were you guys there for that?

Speaker 2: 01:08:25

Yeah. I I I started to take a shower and then Prime knocked on knocked on that door. And he was like, everyone can hear the shower. And in chat everyone's like, LOL, who's chapper?

Speaker 1: 01:08:38

Yeah. I I was watching because I had a video that they're gonna play on that. It was later in the day but like, they had a problem like the stream went down. Oh, what?

Speaker 2: 01:08:46

We left like an hour in.

Speaker 3: 01:08:49

Mhmm. Did did they play your video or no?

Speaker 1: 01:08:51

Yeah. Yeah, they did. Yeah.

Speaker 3: 01:08:52

Oh, they got it. Okay.

Speaker 1: 01:08:53

No, was good. It was a problem.

Speaker 3: 01:08:54

Yeah. We set it up and then we kind of left. Mhmm. So and Prime and Teej wouldn't know how to

Speaker 2: 01:08:59

No, Prime was with us, Adam.

Speaker 3: 01:09:01

Oh, Prime was with us? Okay. Teej wouldn't know how to fix it.

Speaker 1: 01:09:03

For sure.

Speaker 2: 01:09:04

Yeah. He's an idiot.

Speaker 3: 01:09:05

Those guys are they're not

Speaker 1: 01:09:06

very smart. I'm just

Speaker 3: 01:09:09

saying random things now. Think

Speaker 1: 01:09:11

We we can guys we guys did the the feud event. That was awesome. Yeah. Was so That was a good time. Fun night.

Speaker 2: 01:09:19

Yeah. We're gonna do it again in in Miami, which was was gonna be fun.

Speaker 1: 01:09:25

Are you really in Miami?

Speaker 2: 01:09:25

Yeah. We're gonna do it as part of React Miami, just the final thing for the conference.

Speaker 1: 01:09:30

Oh, that's so cool. I I'm so jealous because it's funny I tell my

Speaker 2: 01:09:34

wife your baby around then.

Speaker 1: 01:09:36

Exactly. I can't go. I was this was the year where I was like, oh, you know, I missed it last year. I was very jealous of all these people I've never met in my life. I don't know why I'm so jealous, but it just looks like a good time.

Speaker 1: 01:09:45

Yeah. I was like and then so yeah. This year I was like planning it. I was like, oh yeah, I'm gonna go. And then now we're, you know, now we can't.

Speaker 3: 01:09:50

You didn't plan your pregnancy around React Miami?

Speaker 2: 01:09:53

I got stupid, babe. I'm I'm already making sacrifices for this child.

Speaker 1: 01:09:58

This kid's already ruining my life.

Speaker 3: 01:10:02

Yeah. We'll try to we'll make sure nobody takes any photos at React Miami this year since you'll have FOMO. No. Yeah. We'll keep everything off the Internet.

Speaker 2: 01:10:10

Well, I'm gonna try to maximize the FOMO. Yeah. That's just That's much as possible.

Speaker 3: 01:10:13

That's just not very kind.

Speaker 1: 01:10:14

No. That was the yeah. No. The whole event was fun. It was cool meeting you guys.

Speaker 1: 01:10:18

Yeah. Yeah. It was a good time.

Speaker 3: 01:10:19

Yeah. Glad you came.

Speaker 1: 01:10:20

That was

Speaker 3: 01:10:20

a good time.

Speaker 1: 01:10:21

Well, you were right there. I mean, it's like, I I can walk to the train that'll go to New York in an hour, so it wasn't that hard. It was nice.

Speaker 3: 01:10:27

Wait. You walk for an hour to

Speaker 1: 01:10:28

get on the train?

Speaker 2: 01:10:29

The the trains for

Speaker 3: 01:10:30

an hour.

Speaker 1: 01:10:30

That is dedication.

Speaker 3: 01:10:31

Oh, the train is for that. Yeah. I would've never

Speaker 2: 01:10:33

walked anywhere. Dedication works.

Speaker 1: 01:10:35

I don't

Speaker 2: 01:10:36

think I'll

Speaker 3: 01:10:36

walk places. Alright. Well, it's been so good to have you on Typecraft. It's fun.

Speaker 1: 01:10:43

I loved it.

Speaker 3: 01:10:43

It's We we both got to meet you in New York. Now we get to hang out on the podcast. And now we all have to get work done before the holidays because are you guys is everybody taking off all next week? The way Christmas happened this year, it's like Wednesday.

Speaker 2: 01:10:55

Is Christmas next week?

Speaker 1: 01:10:56

Oh my god.

Speaker 3: 01:10:57

Jackson, you are such a what are you? You are the Grinch or the Grinch He was just like every villain.

Speaker 2: 01:11:06

Christmas was next week. You suddenly make me the Grinch.

Speaker 3: 01:11:10

Do you and Liz celebrate anything or do you just like work all day? You just always work?

Speaker 2: 01:11:14

We just work all day.

Speaker 1: 01:11:15

We celebrate hitting their KPIs and like milestones.

Speaker 3: 01:11:20

Family OKRs. Yeah.

Speaker 2: 01:11:22

Yeah. We do we do use Slack as a family.

Speaker 1: 01:11:25

Who has a squeaky chair by the way? I'm hearing it. Is that Dax?

Speaker 2: 01:11:27

Me. It's me.

Speaker 1: 01:11:28

I have I have the same problem. It ruins so many shots. Such a squeaky ass chair.

Speaker 2: 01:11:33

I really have never noticed it till you pointed it out this moment. So Oh, really? Thank you for that.

Speaker 1: 01:11:38

You're welcome.

Speaker 2: 01:11:39

Isaac, don't pay this in detail, I guess.

Speaker 1: 01:11:41

That's gonna bother you now every waking moment of your life.

Speaker 2: 01:11:43

Liz's family is just so structured. Like, there's always stuff that's set up for us to do for each holiday, we just don't have to think about it. So we're just gonna go. I think her parents house and the whole family's gonna be there.

Speaker 3: 01:11:52

Nice. Yeah. It's next week. Turns out Christmas next week.

Speaker 1: 01:11:55

Do you have any big traditions either you

Speaker 3: 01:11:57

guys? Traditions. So I mean, do the normal stuff. We put up a tree.

Speaker 1: 01:12:01

Yeah. I'm

Speaker 3: 01:12:03

trying to think anything special we do that's like I don't think so. I mean, a

Speaker 1: 01:12:08

tree I I mean, a tree and like all the normal stuff, that's yeah. Yeah. It's nice.

Speaker 2: 01:12:11

I mean,

Speaker 3: 01:12:11

it's a nice Christmas morning. But, yeah, nothing special.

Speaker 1: 01:12:15

For us

Speaker 2: 01:12:15

We go

Speaker 3: 01:12:16

ahead. No one cares that.

Speaker 2: 01:12:17

I was gonna say good. No nobody cares about you. No one cares about my thing.

Speaker 1: 01:12:24

Our whole family goes to my in laws, like my the whole family. My wife is one of seven And Nice. All of her siblings, all their significant others, and our kids, and all their kids all converge on one house, and we stay over Christmas Eve. And so Santa goes to that house that day. And so like, it's just a whole room full of presents for all the kids.

Speaker 1: 01:12:47

It's little chaotic, but fun.

Speaker 3: 01:12:49

Okay, Dax. You can say your thing.

Speaker 2: 01:12:51

No. I was gonna say that's oh, I was gonna that that reminded me of something me and Liz always talk about. So you're so you say your in laws, your wife's family? Mhmm. Yep.

Speaker 2: 01:12:59

So they have achieved something important, which is they have become the central hub for the family despite new people entering the family. And me and Liz always talk about how we need to make sure we maneuver ourselves that way. So we are the place everyone goes to Mhmm. As as they get older and like have their own family. So that's that's impressive for them.

Speaker 2: 01:13:21

Seven seven kids and they were able to retain control over over the holidays.

Speaker 1: 01:13:26

That's crazy. They had this big old house and that they've had forever, about ten years now. Interesting. Am I making the joke old now? Is the joke old

Speaker 3: 01:13:37

now? No. It was old like 10 times ago. It was actually

Speaker 2: 01:13:40

so well done. Was just

Speaker 1: 01:13:41

like in confusion. No. It's and so like this it's because they have this house with like eight bedrooms or something crazy. Yeah.

Speaker 2: 01:13:51

It's a lot.

Speaker 1: 01:13:51

Yeah. So they have they have the space. But but yeah. Does everyone live around you in Miami? Like in that area?

Speaker 2: 01:13:56

It's all Liz's family. So if if you are someone that is born in Miami, you very likely don't leave. So most families here are like still very tight because it's like the extended family lives all within forty five minutes of each other. And basically, her uncle right now it's the same situation. He's just got the biggest house.

Speaker 2: 01:14:13

So he has Mhmm. Kind of de facto control over every holiday and everyone goes there. But at some point, it's gonna need to transition and I'm Yeah. Vying for that And it's gonna be because I'm gonna be a I'm gonna be like a what's it called? A usurper?

Speaker 2: 01:14:26

Because I'm not from the original family. I'm actually Mhmm. Someone new. And if I take over, that would be a big deal. But again, think I have a good shot.

Speaker 2: 01:14:34

Like, I think I'm the one that wants it the most.

Speaker 1: 01:14:36

You're behind

Speaker 2: 01:14:37

the scenes

Speaker 1: 01:14:37

pulling the strings.

Speaker 2: 01:14:43

Love it. But you know, I have to get a big house. My house currently is not big enough for that.

Speaker 1: 01:14:46

Looks super nice though from what I saw from the React Miami stuff.

Speaker 2: 01:14:50

Yeah. It's it's a fun house for sure. For like house parties and stuff, it's a it's a good setup.

Speaker 3: 01:14:55

I I just need to know why people from Miami don't leave Miami. Why is Miami special?

Speaker 2: 01:15:00

It's it's it's a it's just like the Latin culture thing. Like it's families are really tight and this idea of your kids going away, it's culturally really difficult to do because like everyone just guilts the shit out of you. Like it's just it's like not something that's normal, seen as normal at all. Yeah. So Liz left and went to New York for a while and that was like such a big deal.

Speaker 2: 01:15:20

But almost nobody does that. And even when you do, the pool is always there and you probably are gonna end up end up coming back.

Speaker 3: 01:15:28

Oh, man. I I worry about my kids growing up and leaving the area and like That's why you have to live

Speaker 2: 01:15:33

I I that's that's another thing. Like, it's important to to consider moving somewhere that your kids actually wanna live in Yeah. When they become adults.

Speaker 3: 01:15:41

Nobody wants to live in the Ozarks, so I really need to figure that out. I got like ten years

Speaker 1: 01:15:45

Just to figure that start sowing the seeds of guilt. Like, if they leave, you know, it'll be terrible give them Yeah.

Speaker 2: 01:15:52

Family. Just learn from They're pretty good at it. It's funny because like they don't it's this funny dynamic where like when you're here, it's not they actually care. It's just like they just need to know you're nearby. It's not they wanna see you all the time or talk to you or hang out with you at all.

Speaker 2: 01:16:08

It's the fact that you had the goal to leave just becomes a focus point. And when you're back, like, it's not everyone's like, oh, we're so glad you're back and spend all this time with you ever anyway.

Speaker 3: 01:16:16

Yeah. It can only be negative. Thanks again for coming on, man.

Speaker 1: 01:16:19

Thanks for having me on. This was fun. I enjoyed it.

Speaker 2: 01:16:21

Yeah. Do it again.

Speaker 3: 01:16:22

See you. Alright. Cool.

Speaker 2: 01:16:23

See you.

Speaker 1: 01:16:23

See you guys. Bye.