Dax Is Definitely Not Sponsored By Cloudflare and Adam is Definitely a Real Human Being
Uh-oh. I don't hear you.
Speaker 2:It's probably me.
Speaker 1:Oh, my volume was down.
Speaker 2:Wait. What? You can hear me? Yeah. Okay.
Speaker 1:But why are you such a jerk?
Speaker 2:I'm in a lot of trouble. I've gotten in a lot of trouble this week.
Speaker 1:Are you actually in trouble? Can you actually get in trouble? Is it possible for Dax to be in trouble? And with whom?
Speaker 2:Is it possible for me to be in? I guess not.
Speaker 1:Like, real trouble. You know what I mean? Not like Internet trouble. Oh, no. You've been canceled.
Speaker 1:You don't care. But, like
Speaker 2:Well, I'm just saying someone could always just hire a hitman. You know, there's there's there's always that possibility.
Speaker 1:Like, real trouble. Like, you're in imminent danger. That's something you actually have to think about. I don't think I have to worry about that, but that's that's something you could consider. There are a lot of money on the line, Dax.
Speaker 2:I know. It's true. There is a lot of money
Speaker 1:on the line. Something like 300,000,000.
Speaker 2:Sorry. Yeah. Well, I guess 2 things. So I got in trouble after our episode last week
Speaker 1:Oh, right.
Speaker 2:Where I besmirched the name of a company. And
Speaker 1:Yeah. I will say, like, during that rant last week, I do feel like like, I don't know. I wouldn't put that out there publicly. Like, just the things you're saying, I'm kinda surprised. Like
Speaker 2:Okay. So here's here's I thought about this a lot. So, anyway, to summarize very quick, I was very rude and very mean, and I and I hit in some some very sensitive spots
Speaker 1:Are you apologizing? No.
Speaker 2:I'm not apologizing. Of course, I'm not. Come on. It's true. I did all of that.
Speaker 2:And then the the clip went to CEO. The CEO emailed Frank and Jay being, like, you know, whatever. The typical I'm a I'm a talk to your boss situation.
Speaker 1:You got fired.
Speaker 2:And I got fired. Now you're
Speaker 1:looking for a job. Uh-huh. Purcell might be hiring.
Speaker 2:Yeah. And then I quickly messed that one up too. Tell me, that's what happened. But here's here's here's how we perceive it. Right?
Speaker 2:Let's say Apple does, like, a keynote. Right? They're they're doing their own to do a keynote. We're all on Twitter online being like, oh, look at that guy. He's so stupid.
Speaker 2:Like, that guy's adorable. Like, this feature is so dumb. You know, it's it's it's literally just that. And that's all I was doing. I was just doing that same thing.
Speaker 2:But there's this perception that I have some kind of, like, business tie to it, which is why, like, like, this person is not gonna the CEO's company is not gonna email some random person being whatever. But because there's, like you know, I have I have a company, and I and it kinda does it in the same space. It feels, like, inappropriate. And we, so we got that email, and we're like, oh, you know, what would we do if we were on the other side of this? Like, if someone knew this to us, like, what would be our reaction?
Speaker 2:And we kind of thought about, like, what is, like, the actual conflict here? And here's the problem. So as SST, the company, the product, we actually, especially with V3, we have no opinions. Like, whatever you, the user, want to deploy wherever, our role is to help you out. We're not going to be there being like, hey, you should actually use this or like that thing sucks, you should use that.
Speaker 2:So it's a very neutral position. And that's, like, how the company is positioned. But me as an individual real human person, I have my preferences. I have my opinions. I think some things are great.
Speaker 2:I think some things are stupid. And I think people have a hard time understandably have a hard time, like, understanding that these can be 2 things that are side by side and, like, they seem conflicting, but it's fine. Like, I make fun of Next. Js and think it's the worst thing in the world all the time. Simultaneously, if you come to us, try to deploy Next.
Speaker 2:Js, we're gonna bend over backwards and help you. Right? So, like, yeah, it's in conflict, but it's fine. So I think that's that creates, like, confusion around interpreting this, but I personally see it as, yeah, the same way that we'd make fun of any company, way outside of her space.
Speaker 1:Yeah. I guess you do say a lot of, like, similar things, things in the same vein about lots of people, companies, whatevers, and it doesn't really bother me. I think this one was hard for me because, I have a connection to this person, and I hate conflict. Like, I hate I'm a Midwesterner. I want everyone to be happy and glossy, and everything is fine.
Speaker 1:And the connection is Dracula as a theme, I wouldn't have cared. But Look.
Speaker 2:Yeah. The reality is is you're gonna have to switch color themes now.
Speaker 1:I guess so.
Speaker 2:You're gonna have to come over to Tokyo Knight. That's
Speaker 1:just Tokyo Knight's like the default, isn't it, on, like, NeoVim or something?
Speaker 2:I didn't know it was a default. Like, I I I
Speaker 1:know it says whatever reason you can
Speaker 2:get 10 years ago. Exactly. I know. Gabora was a default. I know.
Speaker 2:I saw it. Where did I see it? Was it that guy, Fatty? Oh. I'm I'm probably butchering his name.
Speaker 1:Yeah. I think I know him
Speaker 2:too. Yeah. He, like, just built it all like, all the Go tooling, tons of stuff. I think he had it, like, super long ago.
Speaker 1:And I'm teasing about it being the default, but Dracula is also, like, super basic. Super common. Everybody uses Dracula.
Speaker 2:I've seen Dracula for years for years years years. And at some point, I was like I think I, like, read it wrong, and I was like, oh, it's Darcula. It's a pun.
Speaker 1:So there is a Darcula variant, I think.
Speaker 2:I see.
Speaker 1:I wanna say that is actually a thing too.
Speaker 2:I see. I see. I don't know.
Speaker 1:I use Dracula pro now. Like Yeah. I'm levels above the normal Dracula users. Oh,
Speaker 2:there's a oh, there's a girlfriend.
Speaker 1:There's a paid version. There's a paid for. Slightly different colors, which I'm sure you could just find on the Internet and not have
Speaker 2:to pay for it. Crazy. No wonder recent things so they can make money selling anything. That's the last one. That's the last one.
Speaker 1:Okay. Okay.
Speaker 2:If it makes you feel better, I did message him, and I was like the last thing I said to him was Yeah.
Speaker 1:How are things now?
Speaker 2:Prove me wrong. I mean, the thing is I didn't I don't think I, like, messaged him in a way that he feels good about necessarily, but I did say, you know, okay. Prove me wrong. Like, that's really all we can do.
Speaker 1:You have, like, the opposite personality in me. Maybe that's why I like talking with you because I just dream of being able to do the things you do. Like, I saw the message you sent him, and I'm like, wow. What's it feel like to just be like, now what? What do you want?
Speaker 1:Like, I just can't I can't imagine being like that.
Speaker 2:You know what's crazy, Adam? That's your perception of it. My perception of it is, man, I need to get to a place where I can, like, hold back even less.
Speaker 1:Mhmm. Yeah. Because you've ever since the DHH episode, you're like, how can I be more myself?
Speaker 2:In reality, if this was like like the ideal version of this is Jay got that email and he would reply, w t f, why are you wasting my time with this? And then reply back. Because and and do you know why I thought about this? I was like, Frank sent us a screenshot of a Steve Jobs email. That was
Speaker 1:like seen this?
Speaker 2:The Steve Jobs Adobe email. And it it was, like, way, like, more clever than what I just said. But, it's just clearly, like, it's so to the point and there's 0 fakeness. It's just his exact emotion Yeah. Forward.
Speaker 2:Whereas, you know, the rest of us, we qualify and say things a certain way to make the other person not feel too upset even though it's not it's kinda fake to somebody.
Speaker 1:Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I I read the Jobs biography, and I'm probably every other tech bro that was like, yeah.
Speaker 1:Like, I just I really appreciate that. May I think it's more for me. It's less like, he was a tech tycoon. I just wanna emulate him. It's more just I'm from the Midwest, and it's like you, Steve Jobs, people who are just direct and just say what they think and feel, I just wish I could be that so badly, and I feel like I can't scrub the Midwest off of me.
Speaker 1:Like, just 30 something years living here, I just I can't help but be kinda fake, especially with people I don't know very well. I I really wish I could not be, and I think that's the thing I admired, like, about Steve Jobs, about what I'm seeing in this interaction for you. It just, like, it feels very refreshing. It's so antithetical to how we interact with people in the Midwest. And, maybe that's a blanket statement, but I think it's pretty true.
Speaker 1:Like, I think it's pretty like, East Coast, the whole thing you said about what is really kind, you know, like being direct and actually saying what you think and feel. That's kinder than pretending to be kind.
Speaker 2:Yeah. And what's crazy is I still feel all of what you're describing. Like, it's still very difficult for me to be in situations and feel like, okay, I was, like, true to myself.
Speaker 1:Mhmm. And So maybe I could push through. Maybe there's hope.
Speaker 2:Yeah. So even for me, it's really hard, and I didn't grow up in, like, an environment that even had any, like, the midwestern thing you're talking about. So, yeah, it it it's just it's just hard. And this is a lot dynamic. Like, we are social animals.
Speaker 2:Like, we're just so Mhmm. You know? And, like, there's, like, some value to it, of course. I I don't think Steve Jobs like, I wouldn't, like, literally wanna be Steve Jobs in every every interaction. The other thing that I'm understanding now is I feel like there's also different flavors of this.
Speaker 2:So the Midwest one, I feel like it's an avoidance. Like Yeah. It's more of a topic change or, like Mhmm. Not seeing anything. Yes.
Speaker 2:I think there's a California version of this, which to to me is the Midwest one, I can just, like yeah. Midwest one is just, like to me, it's, like, quirky and funny. You know, it's like a funny funny thing. The California one, I find really weird because it to me, it's extremely passive aggressive, but they think it's not transparent. Like, it'll always be like I mean, even in this email that we got, there's, like, all these lines in it that are, like, so clearly, like, a jab or, like, making a point, but it's, like, wrapped in this language that's supposed to, like, you know, neutralize it or whatever.
Speaker 1:Mhmm.
Speaker 2:And to me, it's, like, extremely passive aggressive and very obvious what they're actually trying to say. And so it seems, like, very shady to me. But I think people that are from California are, like, this is us being polite. Mhmm. Yeah.
Speaker 2:So I I I really don't like that one. That one is tough for me.
Speaker 1:Yeah. No. I'm with you.
Speaker 2:Receiving end.
Speaker 1:I just I I wish, I wish I were born on the East Coast and just had that, like, f you attitude. But, like, coming over later? I don't know. It's just that whole thing. So what'd you do to Vercel?
Speaker 1:Yeah. I I'm catching up now. There's there's some there's some tweets out there.
Speaker 2:Yeah. So yesterday, we posted about so Cloudflare's it's been Cloudflare's birthday week. They've been doing a bunch of releases. One of them was they are now very actively supporting Next. Js on workers because the workers Node.
Speaker 2:Js compatibility story has gotten much, much better. So they have got they've are like, okay, we can like say we're at the support of Next. Js. They messaged us a few weeks ago being like, Hey, we have this adapter. It's working.
Speaker 2:We think it can make a lot of sense to like put it under the open next like, bucket umbrella, which I thought was a good idea. The whole point of OpenNext was instead of these fragmented efforts, let's put it all in one place so that there's some cross pollination. But, you know, in the short term, there is actually no cross pollination. It's just they have their adapter. I did some reworking of our docs so they can put, like, the Cloudflare specific docs in there, and then they publish their adapter to GitHub repo.
Speaker 1:Just to to clarify for everyone who's not familiar with this world, OpenNext does things with the Next build output. But then still, Next is so complicated to deploy. You still need an adapter on top of that, on top of the OpenNext piece to work on a given platform.
Speaker 2:Yeah. So I think the the the way it's it's actually structured is the thing that we built was actually the AWS adapter. So it's now being re re rehoused as open Next. Js / AWS. And now they have open Next.
Speaker 2:Js/CloudFlare. So there's actually no overlap.
Speaker 1:There's no overlap. There's one process to turn a Next. Js build directory into the thing that works on a given platform. I got you. So it's more of like a, branding and then, like, stewardship.
Speaker 1:You're taking over stewardship of this Cloudflare thing, I'm sure, with their support, but putting it under the Open Next.
Speaker 2:So it's like we manage AWS 1. They manage the Mhmm. Cloudflare 1. We have another company that's also gonna be joining in a few weeks.
Speaker 1:Oh, can I guess? Or is that, like, no good?
Speaker 2:It's kinda it's kind of obvious, but
Speaker 1:I was gonna say, there's one thing I can think of, and
Speaker 2:I just wanna say it out loud, but I'm not going to. I'm just gonna Okay.
Speaker 1:Just say.
Speaker 2:So we have another one coming. So we we announced it yesterday. The response was crazy. Like, my post has, like, 2,000 likes.
Speaker 1:Wow. That's, like, Lambo video, like Yeah. Counts.
Speaker 2:It's wild. Like, people were really excited because there is a lot of pent up demand to, like, try out Cloudflare and a lot of the views and actually so everyone was really, really excited. Unfortunately, someone tagged Guillermo in the replies being like, what's your position on this? I, of course, replied with a joke being like, I'm assuming their position is, we wish them the best of luck, but unintelligible jargon. Like, please put that in there.
Speaker 1:I didn't see that one.
Speaker 2:And then So over later, we got an essay from Topg.
Speaker 1:Okay.
Speaker 2:Just saying a bunch of stuff. And
Speaker 1:An intelligible dragon?
Speaker 2:Yeah. It was it was just, like, really defensive.
Speaker 1:That's not that's not common for a defensive top g reply to one of your tweets. Right? Normally, ignoring the policy.
Speaker 2:Smart enough to ignore. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. In it, he implied some things that I was like I, like, didn't really take too seriously because I I don't know if it was just, like, in the heat of the moment.
Speaker 2:He implied, like he says that he's the phrase was something like CloudFlare wants to be, Fin is larger bargain, but basically saying Cloudflare wants to be your host effectively, and they're spending 1,000,000 of dollars on marketing to do this, including sponsoring DAX or, like, partnering with DAX. And I was like, okay. He probably just means that, like, this they're spending money on marketing and separately they're just partnering with us. And there's a bunch of back and forth in there. I, like, made my usual jabs, and I made a I made another post layer that was definitely exceptionally annoying.
Speaker 2:Then today, I the thing that I the only thing that bothers me about his replies was when he describes this as, like, a made up problem. He said that we OpenText is, like, a made up thing for engagement. Like, we we work on this thing to get, like we say that Next. Js is hard to deploy for engagement and likes. I don't like that because I know the people that work on the project, and they, like, they work very hard, and they really like Next.
Speaker 2:Js. So that makes me feel bad, and that's the one thing I have an issue with. So this morning, I posted a screenshot from our the Open Next SOC saying just showing, like, oh, look at this thing they they documented. You know, it's about this pretty complicated thing that can break when you try to self host Next. Js and how they, like, work through it and figure it out.
Speaker 2:And it's, you know, it's interesting to see that this is a tedious work that they do. I was like, it's not made up. It's maybe this is, like, a real thing. Like, these these are real problems. We're not doing this for likes.
Speaker 2:These are the 2 people that work on it, we actually don't know who they are. They are GitHub, no profile picture, work super hard on this thing, amazing. That whole situation. Anyway, that that's my point. And, again, someone tagged him, Guillermo, being like, is this true?
Speaker 2:Which is a weird question. It's just like, what do you mean is this true? Like, do you think we, like, made up this post and we just wrote this? And he replies being like, it's not true. This is probably just a problem with Cloudflare.
Speaker 2:I had nothing to do with Cloudflare. He was like, it's probably just a problem with Cloudflare, like, comma, DAX's new sponsors.
Speaker 1:I saw this. Yeah.
Speaker 2:Yeah. And I'm just like, okay. So you are definitely suggesting that Cloudflare is paying me to now say bad things about you guys. And I was just probably being like, no. There's they're, like, they're not sponsoring Open Next.
Speaker 2:This is, like, not a thing that's happening. Yeah. So it's nothing to do with Lambda. This issue is, like, over a year old. Also, the person that wrote these docs didn't even know about this partner this, like, partnership happening until, like, a week ago.
Speaker 1:And I
Speaker 2:was like, are you really the person to be, like, throwing out sponsorship accusations right now? Like, I know you just kicked the oath to the curb, so now you can say you don't have sponsors, but, like, we all remember. And guess what? There's a really great video on YouTube about how frustrating it is when someone says, oh, but you're sponsored as a criticism made by the person that you were formerly sponsoring. I don't know.
Speaker 2:I honestly was thinking about messaging being like, can can we just do a truce? Like, I at the end of the day, the only conflict here is that I don't really think this stuff is a big deal, and you think Next. Js and front end is, like, the biggest thing ever. I I honestly just wanna, like I have this one more announcement I need to do because new company is gonna Mhmm. You know, join up the next as well.
Speaker 2:Just I'll just, like, never talk about you guys again. Like, I'm happy to do that because it's just, like, going to a super place.
Speaker 1:Nice, actually. I think about it on the podcast, like, just how much Yeah.
Speaker 2:I know.
Speaker 1:I mean, as well as we're making fun of I think we're just kinda both, like, we don't like, a lot of things that that particular company stands for. It's just, like, all the money raised, the front end being this big deal. There's just a lot about that space that's really annoying to me, so I just it's very easy to make fun of. But, yeah, I would love if we talked about it less. It's just it is hard, like, the nature of what you guys work on, it just comes up.
Speaker 2:Yeah. An alternate reaction by Vercel. This would have been my reaction. Right? If I'm Vercel
Speaker 1:Mhmm.
Speaker 2:I am the best place to deploy Next. Js. There's really no threat of that. That's how I really felt. I would have saw this and have been like, this is awesome.
Speaker 2:These idiots are building adapters for us for free. We can now say Next. Js has no vendor lock in. Look. There's, like
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:All this support for it, and we don't have to do any work, and we can, like, completely dodge that criticism. Awesome. That's a good point. My reaction.
Speaker 1:Yeah. Like, people are still gonna, by and large, choose Vercel. Like, the people they're converting or trying to convert.
Speaker 2:Yeah. And including me, I keep telling people just use if you're gonna use it, you're gonna use SnapChat, just use Purcell. Again, one of my, like, personal opinions is that.
Speaker 1:Well, now I've been perusing your Twitter, and I just have so many questions because I've not not seen these live. One, first, not a question, an observation. Liz waking up and being mad at you. Casey gets mad at me about dream Adam all the time. I do stuff in her dreams, and I'm like, it wasn't me.
Speaker 1:You realize I didn't do that. Right? Yeah. Yeah. But what if you did?
Speaker 1:Like, I didn't. I literally didn't.
Speaker 2:To be fair, I am no better.
Speaker 1:What do you mean? You have dreams?
Speaker 2:So sometimes I have a dream about dream ways, and I wake up with the emotions. And I know they're stupid and don't make sense. But I'm like, the reality is I feel mad at you right now. And that's like just because I feel like this thing happened to me. It's gonna take me a couple of minutes for it to dissipate.
Speaker 2:Yeah. It's funny. She she she, like it was funny. I was on my phone, again, dealing with this stupid thing, and I, like, look over and I see her open her eyes, and she gives me, like, the nastiest look. And she goes, I'm mad at you.
Speaker 2:And then she rolls over and she goes and so I was like, because of a dream? And she's like, yeah. But I'm not ready to talk about it. And And then she goes back to sleep. And then then she wakes up again, and she's like, okay.
Speaker 2:I forgive you. And she goes back to sleep. And she wakes up again, and she's like, you did it again.
Speaker 1:Stop waking up and going back to sleep.
Speaker 2:And I I was like, I still don't know what I did.
Speaker 1:I've never had a negative dream about Casey. I'm like a puppy, I guess. I've never had, like, a dream where Casey did something bad. I don't know. I'm just naive.
Speaker 1:Everything's true.
Speaker 2:Had a negative dream, period, or you've never had a
Speaker 1:negative dream about that? I've never had a dream where I was mad at Casey because
Speaker 2:of something she did
Speaker 1:in my dream. Like, she's never done anything in my dreams that was, like, something I'd be mad about, I guess.
Speaker 2:That's funny. I don't have a lot of dreams.
Speaker 1:Do you ever think people are either, like, puppies or kittens? Like, people are either cats or dogs. Like, I'm more of a dog. I'm kind of like like, I'm just happy about everything. Like, play with me.
Speaker 1:And Casey's more of, like, a cat. She's a deep thinker. She's like, she can hold grudges. She can, like yeah. Just yeah.
Speaker 1:Yeah. Yeah.
Speaker 2:Feel like
Speaker 1:you're all cats.
Speaker 2:It's hard it's hard for me to I I get what you're saying. But in my head, all dogs are boys and all cats are girls.
Speaker 1:Oh, interesting.
Speaker 2:Also, I have 2 cats that are literally girls and a dog that's boys. So it might end up just like every single cat in the world is a girl, and every single dog in the world is a boy.
Speaker 1:That's funny.
Speaker 2:No. It's hard for me to see past that.
Speaker 1:Okay. That's fair. Okay. More tweets. Because we're not we're gonna run out of time.
Speaker 1:There's so many so many questions. But, this one's a quick one. What was your sponsor tweet today again? Pee pee, poo poo? What is this?
Speaker 2:Oh, well, after after that accusation that Cloudflare was sponsoring me, Sunil messaged me and said, I'll give you a dollar if you tweet what I say. And he goes pee pee poo poo. I was like, alright. Sold.
Speaker 1:He said, he'll give me a dollar. That's too far. Just like to know.
Speaker 2:Be the first sponsorship deal that I ever get. So
Speaker 1:Look at that. And then his tweet calling you a sellout. Oh, I love it. Okay. That was fun.
Speaker 1:I'm glad I asked. Let's see. What's gonna strip the whole entry? You quote tweeted, Sunil.
Speaker 2:Oh, yes. I'm so excited that we could finally talk about this. You're
Speaker 1:so obsessed with containers lately. What is what happened to you? This container guy. Sorry. Continue.
Speaker 2:Just opened up a whole new world. Do you just, like,
Speaker 1:have Docker running on your Mac all the time now?
Speaker 2:I don't use my Mac. Animal?
Speaker 1:You do to but I use
Speaker 2:my Mac to connect to my Linux machine, which which does have Docker running all the time.
Speaker 1:All the time, I hear it's better on Linux. Sorry.
Speaker 2:I didn't realize. There's no VM. It it running all the time means nothing. It's like not doing anything.
Speaker 1:Yeah. On Mac, it means something.
Speaker 2:Yeah. I've heard.
Speaker 1:I'm not smart enough to know what, but it means my machine is crippled, and so I don't run Docker.
Speaker 2:Continue. Okay. Container boy. So Cloudflare is is, they they haven't launched it yet, but they have had an internal containers platform for a while. It's getting to a point where it can soon be a publicly available containers platform.
Speaker 2:And this is really exciting because the reality is the majority of the industry still uses stateful deployments. I love serverless, love all the cool things we can do with it, but it's an uphill battle. Like, when that's a thing you're showing people, only 1 in x number are going to be like, cool. I want to learn more about that. Whereas containers, you're just selling into, like, an existing habit.
Speaker 2:But they have a launching a containers platform. Why this is really exciting for me is, it's gonna be one of those really modern container offerings where it's just, like, boots up really quickly. Potentially, it, like, scales to 0. You know, like, literally, I can spin up another one in 300 milliseconds, like, kinda like Fly. Mhmm.
Speaker 2:Distributed all around the world. Every single one of their I think it's, like, a 130 effortless. Something like over a 100 data centers.
Speaker 1:So Fly, but with Cloudflare's network?
Speaker 2:Yep. Cloudflare's network and Cloudflare's like, they are at massive scale, which means pricing will be decent. Reliability will be decent. I think right now, if you want that kind of offering, you are looking at, like, newer companies, or like middleman companies that are wrapping other clouds. So I think it's just gonna be really disruptive.
Speaker 2:And combining clouds plus workers plus durable objects sorry. What did I say? Combining containers plus durable objects plus workers. It's it's gonna be a really crazy combo. It makes it feel like a much more complete platform where you can be like, I can run literally anything on here.
Speaker 2:Mhmm. Yeah. Like, I imagine, like, an Elixir distributed cluster that's, like, distributed all around the world, forming a single cluster, which you probably don't wanna do because if there's other reasons you don't wanna do that. But, like, again, it it it it's just a it's just a tool that we have in the middle
Speaker 1:of the year. All kinds of new possibilities. Yeah. Yeah. So you've been an investor in Cloudflare for a long time.
Speaker 1:Am I too late to invest in Cloudflare? Did I miss
Speaker 2:No, dude.
Speaker 1:Like Are they still in the early, early like, in terms of the stock? Sorry.
Speaker 2:It's just so hard to tell. Right? Like, as Yeah. Yeah. So here's what the stock did.
Speaker 2:It went way too high. Like, way, way, way, way too high Yeah. During the pandemic. Like, probably one of the stocks that was affected the most. Mhmm.
Speaker 2:And it is now, like, a third of where
Speaker 1:Nice. Okay. But Okay.
Speaker 2:The problem is where it is now could be the correct value. So I don't know if you necessarily have an edge in investing. Right.
Speaker 1:It's not yeah. But, like, there's still a lot of growth ahead of this company. Like, this is a
Speaker 2:I think so.
Speaker 1:A company at the beginning stages of really disrupting. But you call them hyperscaler. Like, they're already considered I don't know where they fit. Like, if you take, let's say, Google, Azure, and AWS in one little bucket, I don't know if any other companies belong in that bucket, Oracle or something. I don't know.
Speaker 1:But if you take those, like, big, big ones and then you take the flies and the render and whatever all those other littler companies, where does Cloudflare sit? If 10 is the AWS and then, like, one is the littler companies, where how close is it closer to the big ones or closer to the little ones? Like
Speaker 2:It's definitely closer to the big ones. The thing with AWS is they have so many customers, so they're running so many workloads beyond their own. Yeah. Cloudflare's platform is newer. Mhmm.
Speaker 2:So most of their usage is their own, like, their own usage of
Speaker 1:it. Okay.
Speaker 2:So, like, physically, like, they have the infrastructure.
Speaker 1:Could you explain that? Cloudflare's most of Cloudflare usage is Cloudflare?
Speaker 2:Like, the so they basically decided, okay. We're gonna build a platform. We're not just like a DDoS company. We're gonna build a cloud platform. Building a platform takes a long time.
Speaker 2:Like, I think they're on, like, year 8 or 9. I think I would generally say it takes 10 years. Right? Yeah. So they're close to, like, saying, hey.
Speaker 2:We have a real platform.
Speaker 1:And by building a platform, you mean, like, like, data centers, the whole
Speaker 2:Not not that. You mean soft core platform. Like like a user facing offering that you can go and spin up products on. But their core business already involved data center servers all around the world, like, their own networks. They have done a lot of things that AWS hasn't.
Speaker 2:But at the end of the day, in terms of, like, public workloads, AWS has so many, so no one can really compare to them. But they're definitely in a category of well, one, they're a public company. Like, they're just on a different level compared to these other things Sure. In terms of resources. And they have they are at, like, a crazy scale, which is why their offering can be so cheap.
Speaker 2:Whereas, I would say these other options like, Fly is cool because they built their own stuff from day 1. Redbird, it just wraps, GCP. Railway also had wrapped GCP. They just announced they're offering their 1st bare metal stuff. It's in beta now, and they they announced that 2 weeks ago.
Speaker 1:Got it.
Speaker 2:So again, just like a different category. I would say Cloudflare is way more on
Speaker 1:the Wait. Well, yeah. Yeah. I should have realized, like, public company. That's a a tell.
Speaker 1:Like, obviously, they're a large company in that case.
Speaker 2:Yeah. And they need to absorb DDoS traffic, you know.
Speaker 1:Yeah. And that's when you say their core business, that's where they started. Right? Just the, like, the security at the edge kinda thing. That was their main business.
Speaker 1:And then they turned they turned that into this whole cloud platform.
Speaker 2:Yeah. So they, for themselves, had to build servers all around the world and make it super programmable so that their engineers can, like, configure where the traffic goes and, like, add custom logic. And that's where, like, this whole, like, serverless Cloudflare offering we see Yeah. Comes out of. It's it's that's that's what I mean by their usage
Speaker 1:is their own. Yeah. And they're better at that stuff
Speaker 2:than AWS.
Speaker 1:Like, there's not Mhmm. Great options on the AWS side. I mean, there are options, and I guess, like, the cost at large scale isn't that crazy. But Cloudflare, if you're like a startup, like, their their options are just better.
Speaker 2:It's wild how it's such an interesting business because they bet a long time ago that DDoS is gonna continue to be a problem. And you fast forward, it's just like an infinitely growing problem because Yeah. As time goes on, there's just more devices that are turned on in the world. Mhmm. The older they get, the more vulnerabilities they have.
Speaker 2:And so there's just more and more devices available to, like, do a DDoS. Yeah. So it's just, like, this infinitely growing problem. It's, like, cheaper and cheaper and cheaper to do a DDoS. So they're just, like, you, like it's getting to the point where, like, you have to put something like that in front of whatever you have exposed publicly.
Speaker 2:That's why they see I think they see, like, 30% of net traffic or something crazy.
Speaker 1:Yeah. Like, who are the people doing DDoSes? And, like, why? I don't get it. Some of them seem so random.
Speaker 1:Like, if I have a public endpoint up that's not affiliated with anything big, and it starts getting DDoS, it's like, why? Who and why?
Speaker 2:I was working on something the other day on my server. Mhmm. And it involved exposing a port externally. And very quickly, just bunch of requests, just testing for random PHP vulnerabilities. Right?
Speaker 1:Uh-huh. Like, we have dev and staging environments that are not, like, publicly crawlable or, like, discoverable in any way. It's amazing if you just look at logs, just for any Internet property, anything publicly facing, just the amount of noise on the Internet, the amount of requests from, like, random I guess there's, like, WordPress exploits and all these weird things that all these bots are just peppering the Internet with. It reminds me of, like it makes me think of, like, all the radiation just flying around in space. It just feels like this is like this crazy amount of noise that if you tap in, you just say, like, I'm available on the Internet.
Speaker 1:Boom. You just start getting peppered with all that stuff. It's crazy.
Speaker 2:It's really it's really wild. It, like, comes from China. Like, almost all of it is, like, it's coming from China. And it's, and it's I mean, I was talking I don't wanna I don't think I can say who, but, someone was telling me about how their company had a 2 terabyte per second DDoS back in, like, 2019 or 2020.
Speaker 1:Oh my word. That's insane.
Speaker 2:It was from the Chinese government, and it's just normal. The Chinese government literally just blasts companies and products that you know and use with 2 terabytes a second of, of traffic.
Speaker 1:That's crazy.
Speaker 2:And it's like, are they just having fun? Because, like, that one is just maybe they're testing capabilities for, like, disrupting stuff.
Speaker 1:Yeah. It's like doing a missile launch. Like
Speaker 2:Yeah. Exactly.
Speaker 1:It's like a test launch? Okay. We can do that. Now we know if we need to take down a government. Like Yeah.
Speaker 1:2 terabytes second, no problem.
Speaker 2:We got it. In that case, Akamai, I think, was the the protect the DDoS protection person, and Mhmm. They and they handled it.
Speaker 1:Yeah. Man, if I just start thinking about some of this stuff very long, it just kinda blows my mind, like, what we have accomplished as humans. You just start thinking about all the underwater cables, what the Internet physically is, and then, like, all the software layers upon layers upon layers that have gotten us to this point and all the possibilities. Like, we say, Thomas, these weird obscure things people do that I would never do. It's just, like, there's whole worlds that exist digitally and physically that I just don't know anything about.
Speaker 1:And I'm a technologist. Like, I feel like I'm more plugged in than the average person by a lot. And it just kinda boggles the mind. Us humans, we're pretty clever.
Speaker 2:Yeah. I had this experience recently because I don't know if you you probably didn't see it, but, I have been exploring video game streaming. Not like streaming video games I play, but like
Speaker 1:Stadia? Like the Google thing?
Speaker 2:The the Nvidia equivalent?
Speaker 1:Like, pixel what is that called? Pixel streaming? Oh, yeah. I think it's what it's called. Yeah.
Speaker 2:Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So, again, the idea is, so Nvidia obviously has their own GPUs. This is actually super cool because, like, obviously Do
Speaker 1:they they make g oh, yeah. Yeah. Okay.
Speaker 2:Well, it's cool because they can build this service where, like, it's running the GPU in the cloud and, like, sending you the video. They can do it for so cheap because the GPUs are at cost for them. Yeah. But I was like, I tried it out in the past, and I was like, okay. But I saw a post being like, what the hell?
Speaker 2:This stuff is really good now. And I went and tried it. It is incredible. It literally feels like and I
Speaker 1:have I
Speaker 2:have a good GPU locally, so I can compare. Plug in, like, turn on my TV, plug in, like, just the cheapest device, right, that, like, just streams video, connect my controller for yeah. It just looks amazing. The GPU is better than the one I have here. And it's, like, basically no latency.
Speaker 2:Very little it's, like, occasionally you'll get some stutter. And I was like, this is wild that I remember using this before, and now we can literally stream, like, the craziest 4 k detail thing here. It's probably related to, like, I'm sure Netflix, just, like, that whole era of, like, making that all work. I'm sure, like Yeah. That just networked further.
Speaker 1:Technology. Yeah.
Speaker 2:Yeah. And the video compression and all of that. So then I was like, okay. There's some games that, you know, that aren't in that library that I wanna play. Let me try the open source version of this.
Speaker 2:So I installed something on my computer. Mhmm. And, again, it works flawlessly. Like, I can be in any room on my MacBook, just, like, pop it open. Liz is, like, sitting next to me reading a book.
Speaker 2:I can just play a game, and it's streaming from my computer. And it's all over Wi Fi. My my mouse is not wired. I mean, my desktop is wired Yeah. But my laptop is not wired.
Speaker 2:My my TV device is not wired. It's just all over this mesh
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:Hero thing that I have, and it works perfectly.
Speaker 1:So would you say you're looking into is it go beyond just, like, you're just playing games over it? Like, you're looking into it from, like, an infrastructure standpoint? Or what were you saying at the beginning, or you're just just using No.
Speaker 2:No. Just just personally. Yeah. Because I because I'm like, I've always been someone because I like gaming. I do less and less of it every year, but I still like it.
Speaker 2:So I've always had this custom built PC. And I run Linux No. I really
Speaker 1:like to
Speaker 2:Yeah. And I'm like, this is such a hassle to, like, keep this GPU upgrade. It's expensive. It's annoying because, like Yeah. GPUs upgrade, but then other parts are competing to upgrade.
Speaker 2:So it's a whole thing, and I'm just past the point in my life where I'm doing it enough where that's worth it. But I I love quality, so I don't wanna give the quality.
Speaker 1:But
Speaker 2:now, you don't have to.
Speaker 1:I'm realizing I'm confused about how this works. It's not in the browser. There's, like, an app you run. It can
Speaker 2:be in
Speaker 1:the browser. Generic shell. Oh, it can be in the browser. Yeah. But how do you how do you use it?
Speaker 1:You run some kind of client app, and then any game can be played through it? Oh, no.
Speaker 2:Yeah. Yeah. So I don't know
Speaker 1:anything about electronics. No. It's bad.
Speaker 2:But I'm saying it's just a browser. It's all the day it's all browser tech.
Speaker 1:Oh, okay.
Speaker 2:Gotcha. I think the the reason I use the app is because, I think they limit Chrome to 1080p. There's some, like, thing that's a little bit they can't fully control. 8 bitrate
Speaker 1:or something. So there's, like, a platform that you're using for this, I guess? It's an NVIDIA thing?
Speaker 2:So the one I tried is NVIDIA GeForce now. I think it's GHD GeForce now. It's $20 a month for the highest tier. It gets you, like, the nicest GPU.
Speaker 1:Mhmm.
Speaker 2:$20 a month is, like that's like
Speaker 1:That's that's
Speaker 2:like nothing.
Speaker 1:I mean, that like, how many months before you'd buy that GPU at $20 a month? In 4 years. Yeah. And there'll be crazier GPUs by then and crazier games, I'm sure.
Speaker 2:I'm sure, like, if you're someone that, like, buys at the right time, sells it at the right time, upgrades at the right time, you're gonna beat this Mhmm. Of course. Of course. And there's, like, if you don't have good Internet or your Internet's spotty, like, you're not gonna be able to play. But all those trade offs, whatever, it's it's such a good deal.
Speaker 1:That's crazy. Yeah. That's the case where, like, amount of subscription is good.
Speaker 2:You still have to buy it. So there's lots of things. But yeah.
Speaker 1:Oh, okay. So, like, a one time fee for the game? Or
Speaker 2:Yeah. But the thing is so there's so GeForce Now is just a platform to do this. But then there's other game subscription services like, x like, Microsoft has, like, a monthly $10 a month or whatever. And you get, like, a whole catalog. Mhmm.
Speaker 2:So I just, like, went. And the other cool thing is no downloads. I was, like, let me just sign this Microsoft thing. And and I just tried out, like, 20 different games in in, like, one day. That's crazy.
Speaker 2:That's, like, something you can't do. Right?
Speaker 1:Yeah. So this is the big, like, change. I remember as a kid playing, like, Super Nintendo and my parents being like, this is crazy. How did they come up with this?
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:And, like, it was just so beyond anything they could imagine. This is the kind of form of gaming that's coming along that's gonna blow us away, like, the things our kids could do
Speaker 2:Yeah. That we
Speaker 1:couldn't do. We had to buy cartridges, and we had to download games, and we had to, whatever, buy CD ROMs. Now they could just stream from the cloud.
Speaker 2:You don't have to download it.
Speaker 1:There's a hierarchy of downloading machine.
Speaker 2:Which already felt kinda crazy that you can you have to go to the store. You can just, like, download a game. That's crazy. And now you don't have to download it. It's, it's wild.
Speaker 2:Have you seen the Microsoft Flight Simulator 2024? No. Okay. So Microsoft Flight Simulator 2020 was already pretty incredible because it had the whole Earth. You can literally get in a plane The whole earth.
Speaker 2:To the whole earth. And it was it was a bunch of, like, AI involved. Like, they just took a lot of data, like, automatically generated stuff, hand hand tweaked, like, you know, more more popular places. But and it's all one to 1. So if I, like, took a plane from my local airport and flew it to New York, it would take 3 hours in the game for me to do.
Speaker 2:Really? And then 2024 is, like, even crazier. Like, the detail is up, and they do such cool stuff. Like, I you're gonna love this. Okay.
Speaker 2:So they take in and just real time ship data on all the ships in the world.
Speaker 1:You mean, like, planes? Are they called ships?
Speaker 2:No. No. No. Not ships in the ocean. What?
Speaker 2:And then they just put them in the game at the exact position they're in. So if you're flying over the ocean, you look down, it's the exact same thing you see. And they're also ingesting Wait.
Speaker 1:In real time? Like
Speaker 2:real time.
Speaker 1:The real ships are being tracked anyway, and they have all that data. And they put the real ships in the ocean at the real spots. That's insane.
Speaker 2:And I think they're working on, like
Speaker 1:kind of ship.
Speaker 2:Yep. I think they're working on a ship too. And they're working on, like, carriers so you can land on, like, aircraft carriers and stuff.
Speaker 1:So Oh, my word.
Speaker 2:Then the that's not it. Then they're also ingesting wildlife data of where animals are, and you can literally land a place
Speaker 1:anywhere individual animals.
Speaker 2:Individual population.
Speaker 1:Like, this is getting too far. What are they building over there?
Speaker 2:Yeah. Pigeon number 3,043 is right here. Yeah. But it's it's like an Earth simulation. Right?
Speaker 2:So but it's, like, generally where they are. So if you you can, like, land in the savanna and you can walk you can get out of the plane and walk around, and you'll see, like, giraffes and stuff. And then, like, someone Get
Speaker 1:out of the plane on Flight Simulator? Yeah.
Speaker 2:Yeah. That that that's what's so this they're, like, taking it really far where it's, like, yeah, it's a flight sim, but it's, like, becoming an Earth sim.
Speaker 1:This is wild. I feel like governments are gonna use this to, like, simulate diseases and, I don't know, something.
Speaker 2:I mean and they have a project called Earth 2, and they're doing, like
Speaker 1:Like a digital Earth? They should really collaborate, like OpenNext. Maybe this should be under the OpenNext banner. I don't know.
Speaker 2:Well, it got posted on Hacker News, and people were like, oh, man. It'd be cool if they should release this so we can all just build other cool stuff on it. Because and I've always had this feeling, like, some some games make really, really cool environments, but it's just used for a single game. I would love to, like, take this world and, like, use it for a different different game. But yeah.
Speaker 2:Anyway, it's just a and so they have this, like, career mode where you can play as, like, a, like, a medical rescue helicopter or, like, a fire, like, firefighting helicopter, all this stuff. And, like, this is really cool. And it can be rendered in the cloud and streamed to you.
Speaker 1:Oh, and played. Oh, okay. So the that that franchise has always been well regarded. Right? It's, like, it's very crazy accurate.
Speaker 1:Like, who is behind that? Like, was it just some former pilots that got hired by Microsoft and have this passion for this? Like, it feels like so much it it's the kind of thing where it feels like there's so much energy and something invested into something. There has to be reasons that they care so much about making this so good. Or is it just that people like it and they buy it?
Speaker 2:It's it's so technical too. Right? It's just, like, a technical to build, like, a simulator, it's very technical engineering oriented.
Speaker 1:Yeah. Like, all the different aircraft cockpits and stuff. Like, I've seen the screenshots. It's, like, they've really, like they've got all the planes and all the details about the plane. It's just crazy.
Speaker 2:Yeah. So you have to, like, know how to build that simulation, and you have to understand, like, the physics of air and, like, how the winds affect it so you can implement it in the
Speaker 1:game. Sure.
Speaker 2:It's, like, really, really talented, incredible people that work on it.
Speaker 1:Pilots use this to, like, learn things? I mean, I feel like do they, I guess? Like, it feels like so much effort put into something for just, like, nerds to play on the weekend. Yeah.
Speaker 2:No. I I think it's used I think it's used in, like, light training stuff.
Speaker 1:Yeah. You know, my brother is a pilot. Have I talked about that?
Speaker 2:Yeah. That's so crazy. Like, it's just to me, it's just just just just so that's so outside the range of a normal life.
Speaker 1:Yeah. Just fly around every day. Yeah. Like, I he's constantly in Atlanta. He's based out of Atlanta, but he lives here near me.
Speaker 1:Like, they just commute. They just hop on a plane in the morning.
Speaker 2:Their whole job is to commute. There's no, like, I can't even arrive. The commute is a job.
Speaker 1:They can just, like, get on a plane to go to the place where they're actually supposed to fly from. It's like
Speaker 2:Oh, yeah.
Speaker 1:It's a hour and a half flight to Atlanta from here. So he just has, like, an hour and a half commute, but not a normal commute. We're talking, like, 8 hour drive commute. I guess there's people that, like, commute to San Francisco from LA, like, rich people that have jobs in Silicon Valley.
Speaker 2:It's like, in our head, it's a 1 and a half hour commute. A lot of people have a 1 and a half hour commute. And it's it's technically the same thing, and he probably perceives it in the same way. But for us, we're like, you are literally going to, like, another place. Like, how is this happening?
Speaker 1:Yeah. And, like, twice a week. It's like it's crazy. Pilots. Like truck drivers, but classier.
Speaker 1:Much classier. Sorry, brother.
Speaker 2:You're gonna you're gonna get an you you're gonna get an email from the truck driving CEO after this one.
Speaker 1:I I wanna say something here. You that reminded me, to our listeners. It's because sometimes I forget we have listeners, and we're not just hanging out. I get a lot of emails or messages after every episode. Like, it's funny, this last one.
Speaker 1:The number of people that reached out being like, oh, yeah. Yeah. React Native sucks for that. Here's the thing you should use. And I'm already forgetting.
Speaker 1:I think it was capacitor was the the consensus. It's just crazy. It's kinda fun to have a podcast where you can, like, just publicly complain about something, and then everyone's like, here's answers. Here you go. Solutions.
Speaker 1:Thank you Yeah. To all of you listeners that offer up information. I don't always reply, not like I'm snooty. It's just like, you can ask DAX. I don't always reply to stuff I should reply to work related, terminal things.
Speaker 1:Just sometimes I get busy, and I just ignore DMs. That's the first thing they go for me, DMs. It's the first thing I just kinda, like, wholesale or just communications in general. Like, when I'm busy,
Speaker 2:I got all the
Speaker 1:programming stuff in my brain. I just I stop communicating. Sorry.
Speaker 2:You know what the is an example of this, like, being able to get help? And it's such a weird superpower to have. I had I don't know if you saw this, but I had, like
Speaker 1:it was a few
Speaker 2:months ago. I had these, like, flies in my sink. Like, they kept kept, like, killing them, but they just kept coming out of, like, our sink.
Speaker 1:Out of your sink, like, out of the drain?
Speaker 2:Yeah. Out of the drain. And it's a very, like, common thing, apparently, but I've never had that before.
Speaker 1:Really?
Speaker 2:And And I was like, what? They're really tiny. They're super, super small.
Speaker 1:And I
Speaker 2:was like, what the hell? Like, what should we do? We're looking up online, like, pour water hot water down, do this and that. We tried it all. It just they just kept coming back.
Speaker 2:And then I posted about it, and someone was like, oh, yeah. Before I was an and, before I was a software engineer, I was like, a food safety, like his job was to, like, design how kitchens, like, stayed clean, basically. And he was like, here's a link to this thing. And it was like some weird foam that he'd like me to. And then I just took I got it.
Speaker 2:I heard it. And I sprayed it down the down the sink. And I was like, I don't think I did this right because, like, some part of it was messed up. Next day, completely gone. And I was like, I don't think I would have ever solved this problem.
Speaker 2:I think it would have moved out of my house. I think that's what it would have happened otherwise. Just immediately fix it. And I don't think would have found it otherwise.
Speaker 1:They they were I know you didn't, like, intend probably to delve into the details of this, but I'm going to, because I just have I'm curious curiosities. The they were coming up from, like, from the plumbing out of the drain?
Speaker 2:They're called drain flies. Yeah. Yeah. So they're like
Speaker 1:Next question is, isn't there like a bend in the pipes that, like, keeps water at all time? Like, how did the flies get through the little bend?
Speaker 2:The bend is what makes it possible, I think. Oh. Because the bend allows for I forgot it's like a name of there's like a name of that piece of the pipe, if I remember what it is. But I think it it leaves, like, a pocket of air or something. So when you run water through, there's, like, technically an area that
Speaker 1:That stays.
Speaker 2:That can yeah. So I think you'll, like, get you'll get a bunch of them, but eventually, they'll, like, there'll be this area that just not being hit with water.
Speaker 1:Okay. Interesting.
Speaker 2:Yeah. But, and this here's the craziest part. I was looking this up online, and I was like and people were saying that yeah, oftentimes if you, like, make it a problem for them, they'll move to another drain in your house, like, through the pipes. People were like, yeah. We got rid of them here, but then
Speaker 1:They popped up over there? Yeah. Like whack a mole.
Speaker 2:You're right that there there is this bend, and I don't really understand where
Speaker 1:I thought that kept, like, water in between.
Speaker 2:I mean, we we have a garbage disposal. It's possible they're, like, somewhere they were somewhere in the garbage disposal. It's it's hard to hard to tell. Mhmm. But, yeah, drain flies to think.
Speaker 1:Drain flies. Just learned something new today.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:How are the mosquitoes doing since Mosquito Joe did his thing there? If I wanna come to Miami soon.
Speaker 2:Better. They're a lot better. It's just not a 100% effective. It's way better than it used to be. And if the good news is if I'm, like in the morning, if I spend 5 minutes killing them with the we got a new electric racket, and this one's way better.
Speaker 2:Oh. It's so good. Yeah. It's it's it's got multiple the one that you use had a single layer of electricity. This has, like, 3 layers of electricity, so basically impossible to go through.
Speaker 1:Can't miss. You can't
Speaker 2:miss. And it's this really nice pop, which, you know, you experienced. I love that pop. Morning, if I spend 5 minutes just getting there's, like, these usual locations where they are. Like, I spend 5 minutes getting them.
Speaker 2:It's, like, pretty good for the day.
Speaker 1:They're gone. Yeah. Much better. Not experience that. We did not ever have a date where it was, like, we're good.
Speaker 2:You just gotta wait
Speaker 1:and go on.
Speaker 2:Repel the next time. Like, we're so stupid for not thinking of that.
Speaker 1:I was so stupid for not thinking of that. So true.
Speaker 2:All of us. I didn't even think about that either.
Speaker 1:Yeah. Next time. When is next time? I guess they're talking about React Miami already.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:Like, that's is this are they selling tickets already? Is it that soon? Or do they do it that early?
Speaker 2:Yes. They're selling tickets, and they're selling a lot, way more than they did previously. Nice. Did you
Speaker 1:get distracted? I feel like I got distracted and you got distracted.
Speaker 2:A little bit. Yeah. We both just got distracted.
Speaker 1:Maybe the same thing.
Speaker 2:What did
Speaker 1:you get distracted by?
Speaker 2:No. I was looking at the clock.
Speaker 1:Oh, just looking at the clock. That board,
Speaker 2:No. I have to go in something for me. I might not even have
Speaker 1:Oh, yeah. Yeah. We'll see. We can get off here. Next week, special guest.
Speaker 1:So exciting. We'll keep that as a teaser. Yeah.
Speaker 2:We're gonna have someone on next week.
Speaker 1:This this episode, as always, is brought to you by Terminal Coffee. You can buy your coffee from the terminal. S h, terminal dot shop. Let's take a break. Sorry.
Speaker 2:Also, it's not just sponsored by Terminal according to Vercel. It's also sponsored by Cloudflare.
Speaker 1:Oh, yeah. We might as well give them credit since people think that they're sponsoring. Yeah. They're not. Believe it.
Speaker 1:There's no money flowing from Cloudflare to any of us. Well, I think. I don't actually know. Probably not.
Speaker 2:There is not. Okay.
Speaker 1:Well, enjoy your meeting.
Speaker 2:Okay.
Speaker 1:This meeting might end a little early, so you can get on your meet other meeting.
Speaker 2:Yeah. Okay. See you.
